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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 08 Jun 2017, 03:28
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tireks

date back to can be used both actively and passively.

An example from Collins:

The brooch dates back to the fourth century BC.
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Hi tireks, this is not the same usage. The sentence under consideration uses dated at. Hence, we should be looking at the usages of dated (as a past participle) and not dates (as a verb).

Also, if you could cite an official example, that might be more useful.
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 27 Jun 2017, 23:37
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GMATNinja & GMATNinjaTwo Could you help to explain "VERBing - dating" in this problem? Why "dating" is placed after the pronoun "both"? What is being modified here?
The -ing modifier ("dating") modifies "communities" -- and the adverb "both" modifies "dating." In other words, both the Acoma community and the Hopi community date back at least a thousand years, and the word placement isn't a problem at all.
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Hi GMATNinja,

As per your explanation "both" is an adverb modifying dating. And we know that COMMA + -ING modifier always modifies the entire previous clause. But I am not able to understand how "dating... " can modify the previous clause. I see no relation of -ING modifier to the verb of the previous clause. Can you please explain? Thanks a ton!!
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 28 Jun 2017, 17:56
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Quote:
And we know that COMMA + -ING modifier always modifies the entire previous clause.
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Not always. "-ing" modifiers can modify an entire clause... or just a noun (see the explanation by egmat above). We could argue that "dating" modifies the Acoma and Hopi, or that it modifies "communities" -- but the difference between those two isn't terribly important, because those two are the same in this sentence, anyway.

I hope this helps!
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 29 Jun 2017, 10:01
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As per your explanation "both" is an adverb modifying dating. And we know that COMMA + -ING modifier always modifies the entire previous clause. But I am not able to understand how "dating... " can modify the previous clause. I see no relation of -ING modifier to the verb of the previous clause. Can you please explain? Thanks a ton!!
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Hi yt770, there is correlation between the participial phrase (both dating back...) and the previous clause.

The clause states that the Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo communities; subsequently, the participial phrase elaborates to what extent these communities are old: both date back at least a thousand years.

On the other hand, had the sentence been (say):

The Acoma and Hopi considered children born into the mother's clan, both dating back at least a thousand years.

In this sentence, there is indeed no correlation between the clause and the participial phrase. Hence, use of participial phrase would be incorrect here.

p.s. Our book EducationAisle Sentence Correction Nirvana discusses these issues with participial phrases, their application and examples in significant detail. If someone is interested, PM me your email-id; I can mail the corresponding section.
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 28 Oct 2020, 05:03
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo communities, both dating back at least a thousand years.


(A) both dating

(B) both of which have dated

(C) and each has dated

(D) and each one dating

(E) each one of which date
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This question is based on Modifiers and Construction.

In Option B, the present perfect tense “have dated” is incorrect because there is no connection established between the past and the present in the sentence. The present perfect tense indicates that till the present, the communities have dated back at least a thousand years but this fact may change in the future. The meaning thus conveyed is illogical. So, Option B can be eliminated.

In Option C also, the present perfect tense is inappropriate. Furthermore, the conjunction ‘and’ in Option C implies that dating back is an action done by the two communities. Since this meaning is illogical, Option C can also be eliminated.

Option D is incomplete. The conjunction ‘and’ should be followed by a clause as the coordinating conjunction joins a clause to a clause and a phrase to a phrase. So, Option D can also be eliminated.

In Option E, the plural verb ‘date’ does not agree with the singular subject ‘each’. So, Option E can also be eliminated.

The participle ‘dating’ describes how the communities are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo communities. The use of the modifier in Option A avoids the errors in the other options. Therefore, A is the most appropriate option.

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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 24 Jan 2022, 09:38
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@egmat,@gmat ninja. There are many answers saying the present perfect tense cannot be used in option C. Can you guys please explain
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 29 Jan 2022, 08:35
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@egmat,@gmat ninja. There are many answers saying the present perfect tense cannot be used in option C. Can you guys please explain
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The issue is more with the logic than with the grammar.

I could write, "The ancient scroll has been dated at x," because it's not unreasonable for a scroll to have been studied in the past and to continue to be studied into the present. So the present perfect isn't really a problem.

But if I begin a sentence with "The ancient scroll has dated..." I'm making sound as though this ancient scroll was either assessing the date of another scroll or going on dates with other scrolls! An interesting idea for a wacky cartoon, but not a terribly logical sentence on the GMAT.

Same deal here: (C) kind of makes it sound as though the communities are going on dates. Kinda sexy, but also kinda nonsense. :D

I hope that helps!
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The Acoma and Hopi are probably the two oldest surviving Pueblo commun 05 Jan 2024, 00:18
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