Shawshank
str1der
Like to weigh in from an international student's perspective and also as an 'outsider' (read prospective international applicant) who applied to schools
Perspective 1: International Student
Neither Tuck nor Stern by their own have a very well known brand name outside of the US. However, NYU is much better known internationally than Dartmouth. This may seem ironic but its true. However, the term Ivy League, irrespective of its actual weightage/value etc., gets thrown around a lot. So if you say you went to an Ivy League business school to an employer in India for example, they do sit up. If you say you went to NYU Stern, they'll say OK I know about NYU, but don't know how good/bad it is and what Stern is.
Perspective 2: Outsider
When I visited the US in April last year, I visited NYU Stern. I wasn't impressed - the facility is a building, the common areas where you have parties etc. are essentially rooms in that building. I actually felt a bit suffocated, and taking the lift to go to classrooms just felt a bit weird. I strongly felt I was visiting an office rather than a school. I understand that space is limited in NYC, but I somehow didn't feel too good about paying $100K plus in tuition and going to that sort of facility. We sat in a classroom where we got a download from the admissions team - again, I didn't like the classrooms at all. The other school I went to was Wharton, which was much, much better. Plus, NYU Stern just didn't give me a good sense of campus camaraderie.
The other aspect I must mention, is that in April I networked with many current/former MBA students. When I told them I visited Stern because it may figure on my list of schools, I typically saw a quizzical face on the other end. Folks didn't seem to think it was a great program, certainly not 'prestigious'. Everyone acknowledges its good for finance, but is it the best school for finance - NO. The location lends some advantage maybe, the vast alumni network definitely does, but there's nothing more to it. Based on this perception, plus the feel I got when I visited the school, I dropped it from my list.
After receiving news of my admit, I sent messages to friends who have gone to Tuck, Yale, HBS, Stanford, Wharton, INSEAD etc. I even spoke to the former admissions director of a top 3 school, who mentioned that Tuck is a fantastic program (she stressed on the fantastic bit). Essentially, those who are in the know, deeply admire the school. Hence, in terms of prestige, I certainly feel Tuck beats NYU hands down.
I think this analysis is spot on. I have not visited stern, but friends who have visited have echoed similar sentiments regarding the facilities. I did however attend a session in my home city that was hosted by an admissions officer. It was super laid back, and we just mingled with 6 stern alums who showed up. I hate saying this, but I was extremely unimpressed by the alums. I then asked friends who went to top b-schools on their thoughts on stern, and their reaction was very similar to what str1der described, some even worse. For example, a buddy who did wharton and now works in MBB office in europe talked about joint finance career treks with other schools. He remarked that the sternies stood out as not being as sharp and accomplished and had a chip on their shoulder. I heard similar comments from other folks as well. I badly wanted to apply to stern because of its NYC location and quality of finance courses, but ultimately I realized that there are better options out there.
As for the facilities, I thought they were fine, not bad, not great, but it's what I expected in the middle of Manhattan, perhaps even a bit better. And, by the way, Columbia's facilities are WAY worse in my opinion, which I think is relevant considering no other top schools have campuses quite so embedded in a major city as these two. So Columbia is a good reference point (however, Columbia will have new facilities in the somewhat near future, I think). From a pure building & facilities perspective, I think it's a bit ridiculous to compare the the facilities of any school in downtown Manhattan to one in the middle-of-nowhere New Hampshire. It's not a fair fight. At Dartmouth they have the luxury of space, but not much else (outside of the school community). At Stern/Columbia, you have no space, but you have Manhattan.
Shawshank, I think your comments regarding Stern are a bit over the top; it almost seems like
you have a chip on your shoulder, or that you have something against Stern. No one is saying that Stern is as prestigious as Tuck (although it's not that far behind, no offense to Tuck, but it's Tuck we're talking about, not Wharton, the difference isn't big), but my personal experience with Stern has been great so far. The students seem very bright, friendly, and enthusiastic about their school. The sense of community, at least as far as I could tell from two visits, was much stronger than I would have expected at an inner city bschool. The two professors I heard from seemed to really know their stuff as well. And they have maybe the most impressive list of course offerings I've seen.
I apologize for my defense of Stern, I probably won't even end up going there, but I don't like to see seemingly random school bashing. Both of these schools are great. If Shawshank's opinion was the generally accepted one, no one would go to Stern, they wouldn't be ranked nearly as well as they are, and you'd have already "known" that Stern was a crappy school just from reading posts on GMAT Club. I would take any single person's perception of the school, in isolation, with a grain of salt (including mine...haha).
My guess would be that your success in getting a job in finance will be more tied to you personally and what's on your resume, and not as much to the slight difference in prestige of these two schools. If you want investment banking, Stern will get you there just as easily as Tuck I would suspect. If you want buyside, knowing nothing about you I would say your chances are slim at either of these schools, unless you have some awesome and/or relevant prior experience or connections. So depending on what exactly you want, the added Tuck prestige may or may not help you, and you should probably just go where you see yourself having a better experience.
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22 Jan 2013, 05:27
