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dabral
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 02:13
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There is one key reason why GMAC will never disclose question specific responses. This has to do with the fact that the experimental questions are mixed in with the questions that count towards one's score. In quant, supposedly 9 out of 37 are experimental questions. This means that if GMAC were to disclose the difficulty level of each question, then one might be able to figure out the pattern of how the experimental questions are placed in the exam. This is something that they will want to safeguard.

My suspicion has always been that the experimental questions likely fall between Question#10 and #30 in the quant, although there is no reason why they can't be mixed in other places. Based on my GMAT test experiences, I rarely have noticed a departure in expected difficulty level at the beginning or the end of the test. Also, in the old PowerPrep GMAT software, the experimental questions used to be at position, 8, 11, 14, 17, 20, 23, 26, 29, and 32. Not that this proves that they would stick with the same pattern in the real CATs.

If the GMAT changed to a format where an entire section is experimental, similar to GRE, then they would have more of a freedom to disclose question level details. I don't see that happening.

And I don't agree with GMAC charging for this dilute diagnostics report, $24.95 is just ridiculous. They already charge an arm and a leg for the exam, $250. Many students taken it twice or more, and they are still looking to extract more money from students. This is in addition to the new $100 amount for reinstating a canceled score.

Dabral
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 02:59
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Could someone please explain little more about experimental question. How it appears and does it carry any weight on scoring?

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Ammu
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 03:50
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VeritasPrepBrian
Regarding the diagnostic report on the official exam and what it will contain...

The current installment is a pilot program for GMAC to gather feedback on what will and won't be useful, actionable information for users. The plan is to charge $24.99 (that could change, but that was the number they cited) for students to access the report, so GMAC wants to ensure that it's providing fair value for that price.

As of now, I'd argue that the most useful feature will be a question-type-by-question type adaptive score to tell you how you performed on, say, Sentence Correction vs. Critical Reasoning and Reading Comprehension. Right now you just get you overall scaled score of for example 39, but this would give you a similar score for each question type. If you were 39 on Verbal but 32 on SC, you could glean from that that you really need to emphasize SC. And even if you get a feeling right now from how the test felt, this would be useful as actual data.

They're also piloting a pacing metric, but as a lot of us pointed out if you rush on the last 4-5 questions but still finish in 75 minutes, your pace per question will be the 2:04 Q / 1:47 V that just divides 1:15 by 37 or 41 and might not be that helpful, so they're tinkering with other reporting possibilities to provide meaningful data.

All that said, they didn't rule out item-by-item correct/incorrect (and that was a question specifically asked) but my guess is that they won't do it. (not that they're secretive at all about the scoring algorithm, but they likely don't want to promote a culture of trying to dissect item responses in order to "crack" the CAT, and also without the questions there the item-by-item probably isn't all that diagnostic, so they also have a vested interest in not encouraging people to memorize questions to try to dissect them later)

But the bigger story - GMAC continues to push to be more transparent so that those who are working hard to maximize their GMAT scores have more resources and opportunities to do so. AND this tool is still in development and beta specifically so that they can determine what would be most useful to test-takers, so it's not a bad idea to keep brainstorming your wishlist publicly on GMATClub so that good ideas get out there and have the potential to be included.
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Hi VeritasPrepBrian

Would you kindly explain what is happening . Could you summarize what is happening in GMAC summit & what is GMAC upto ?

Is GMAT in a way going to provide Diagnostic report as we get in mocks ?

Regards
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 03:51
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dabral
There is one key reason why GMAC will never disclose question specific responses. This has to do with the fact that the experimental questions are mixed in with the questions that count towards one's score. In quant, supposedly 9 out of 37 are experimental questions. This means that if GMAC were to disclose the difficulty level of each question, then one might be able to figure out the pattern of how the experimental questions are placed in the exam. This is something that they will want to safeguard.

My suspicion has always been that the experimental questions likely fall between Question#10 and #30 in the quant, although there is no reason why they can't be mixed in other places. Based on my GMAT test experiences, I rarely have noticed a departure in expected difficulty level at the beginning or the end of the test. Also, in the old PowerPrep GMAT software, the experimental questions used to be at position, 8, 11, 14, 17, 20, 23, 26, 29, and 32. Not that this proves that they would stick with the same pattern in the real CATs.

If the GMAT changed to a format where an entire section is experimental, similar to GRE, then they would have more of a freedom to disclose question level details. I don't see that happening.

And I don't agree with GMAC charging for this dilute diagnostics report, $24.95 is just ridiculous. They already charge an arm and a leg for the exam, $250. Many students taken it twice or more, and they are still looking to extract more money from students. This is in addition to the new $100 amount for reinstating a canceled score.

Dabral
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Hi dabral

Would you kindly explain what is happening . Could you summarize what is happening in GMAC summit & what is GMAC upto ?

Is GMAT in a way going to provide Diagnostic report as we get in mocks ?

Regards
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 04:31
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Does this mean that current IR scores will be considered or it will be considered for the exams after the decisions are official.
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GMAC annual summit 2014 20 Nov 2014, 09:39
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ammuseeru

This is what I know about experimental questions on the GMAT:

1) 9 out of 37 questions in the quant are experimental and 11 out of 41 questions in the Verbal are experimental. I don't have an official source for this number so this data could be wrong. I know the old GMATPowerPrep did not count 9 of the 37 quant questions so these numbers may be correct.

2) Experimental questions do not count towards your score. It is unlikely that you would be able to tell which questions are experimental and which are not. It is not even worth wasting your energy on it.

3) There is one circumstance where you can make a guess and that is if you are scoring really high(prior scores of 750 or so) and you see a question at #20 and it asks you to find the hypotenuse of a right triangle with sides 6 and 8. It is most likely an experimental question. I have experienced it in the real GMAT.

4) Official GMAC sources have also confirmed the following: "the process for experimental items is the same for every examinee and every instance. Each examinee will receive the same number of experimental items as every other examinee, without regard to current or past performance."

5) Based on this blog post, it seems that Larry Rudner may have disclosed more details about the experimental questions: "On the actual GMAT, the number of experimental questions may not be 1/4thas previously assumed. Or they may be of that proportion. This is a secret sauce that the folks at GMAC are not yet willing to reveal. :) However, here is something that can help you “guess” better: the experimental questions will typically NOT be at the beginning or the end of the test. In other words you will typically get the experimental questions around the middle of the test (say questions # 10- #30)."

This was always my suspicion and I always recommends students to skip in the 10 to 30 range, if they encounter a hard questions. Of course, you can't afford to skip or let go many questions if you are targeting a high score.

I have given you what I know and the source of that information. Ultimately, you just have to focus on doing the best that you can, and ignore all this noise.

Cheers,
Dabral
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GMAC annual summit 2014 Updated on: 15 Jan 2015, 08:57
Originally posted by kroata on 20 Nov 2014, 21:06.
Last edited by kroata on 15 Jan 2015, 08:57, edited 1 time in total.
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re: "Diagnostic report of a cancelled score will also be made available on request."

Any clue when will this be available or if it already is???
[/b]
I am in a very awkward situation because I freaked out due to what I think was a very low score on my official GMAT exam so I immediately cancelled my score and did not get to see my Q and V scores. I think for the price I paid I deserve to have this information without necessarily reinstating my score.

Thank you in advance!
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GMAC annual summit 2014 21 Nov 2014, 02:39
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Hello souvik101990,

Thanx for the great debrief regarding the GMAC summit. I have developed some curiosity after reading your sessions overview about how a GMAT item moves from experimental phase to become a real coutable GMAT item (ques.). I think many a lot fellow members will feel "enlightened" a bit more about GMAT's scoring patterns and algorithms and its psychometrics. Thanx in advance :)
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GMAC annual summit 2014 25 Nov 2014, 10:21
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Manhattan GMAT Summit debrief
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GMAC annual summit 2014 25 Nov 2014, 22:03
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The diagnostic preview tool looks great.

Honestly, I think before they start out with new things, they need to fix the paid GMATPrep tests. There are repeats including from within the same tests itself. I have raised it multiple times with GMAC but to no avail.

Arun
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GMAC annual summit 2014 25 Nov 2014, 22:19
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Arun,

The Exam Pack 1 tests are meant to be used only once. The sequence should be: take Exam 3 once, then take Exam 4 once. If you just do that there should not be any repeat of any questions in those two tests. At least this is my experience and those of my students. Now if someone takes Exam 3 twice, then takes Exam 4, then yes there will be questions repeated.

This is what GMAC says on their website about Exam Pack 1 and repeats: "*Note: With Exam Pack 1, you receive 2 full-length exams, on your 3rd attempt on either exam, you will see repeated questions. "

I believe by 3rd attempt they mean that the 1st attempt is Exam 3, second is Exam 4, and the next attempt on either test would be the 3rd attempt. If that is the case, then it is in line with my own experience.

In summary, one should only plan to use them once, and that too in sequence. The main reason for the repeats is that the database of questions is far too small in Exam Pack 1. In quant it is about 200 questions.

Cheers,
Dabral
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