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With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J

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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 13 Jul 2014, 22:21
Thanks EducationAsile.

I have got the point that the phrase can modify the noun. I have one more query. If we change "considered as" to "considered" in choice C then do we have any other errors in choice C?


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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 13 Jul 2014, 22:31
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With C, the sentence would be:

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

Even if it is just considered, C has a meaning issue. The intended meaning is that Europa is too cold to support life; a proof given to this effect is that its 60 square miles of water is thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

However, C uses and and hence seems to incorrectly suggest two independent things about Europa:
i) Europa is too cold to support life
ii) Europa has 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 11 Sep 2014, 04:51
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With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, [Prep phrase]
Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and
with
60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom. [another prep phrase]

Both of the prep phrase as here to support the fact that Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life.
Its between A and B.
(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with
>>At first look and with seemed to be || with With surface temperatures. Also IMO, comma+And shall introduce another IC but here its an phrase.
Can someone please elucidate on this?

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its
>>Correct. More crisp than A.
Phrase "its ..." is modifying Europa though its not touching or quite far from modified noun. Can be read as
Europa ,its ...., has long been considered far too cold to support life.

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has
>> prep phrase is converted into another clause which is wrong.Reason, now both r acting at same level in sentence structure.Whereas, original intention is two use two phrases to conclude something.
Considered as not correct.

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its
>> Missing main verb. Considered as is not correct here.Even second part ,post comma+and, is missing the verb.
(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have
>>Considered to be is not correct here;Missing main verb
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 14 Sep 2014, 11:40
As per solutions above answer choice C is incorrect because it is using wrong idiom, "considered as". What if the answer choice read, " Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life and has"? Would it be correct then? I am asking because this sentence makes perfect sense,
" With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit,Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life and has 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."

Can experts please advise elaborate on above?
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 15 Sep 2014, 03:27
nitin6305 wrote:
As per solutions above answer choice C is incorrect because it is using wrong idiom, "considered as". What if the answer choice read, " Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life and has"? Would it be correct then? I am asking because this sentence makes perfect sense,
" With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit,Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life and has 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."

Not sure if you had the opportunity to read my post, a couple of posts above this, directly addressing this point.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 21 Sep 2014, 01:10
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With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with - comma+ and starts new clause, here absence of subject in 2nd clause is problem

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its - correct answer

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has - Wrong Idiom

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its - Wrong Idiom

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have - Wrong Idiom
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 02 Oct 2014, 14:22
If we read the original sentence as ,

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life.

Does it make sense? My point is that both the the "with" phrases modify the same saem clause, "Jupiter's moon...." and are paralle as well, then why is the sentence as is wrong?
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 03 Oct 2014, 05:33
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nitin6305 wrote:
If we read the original sentence as ,

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life.

Does it make sense? My point is that both the the "with" phrases modify the same saem clause, "Jupiter's moon...." and are paralle as well, then why is the sentence as is wrong?



Check comma+end - it starts a new clause , which should contain a subject and a verb. In this new phrase subject is missing. \If we repeat subject in this clause then sentence would be correct.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 04 Dec 2014, 22:40
Marcab wrote:
nelz007 wrote:
With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have

will provide OA after explanations.

Answer must be B
First of all we do have to consider the correct usage of "With".
ex- "With 4 childrens at home, Rachel barely has any spare time for her hobbies".
Notice that the two clauses of the above sentence are reinforcing into each other.
So the sentence must complete after the second clause. If it does'nt, then the third clause must be a modifier, modifying the preceding clause.
B does it correctly.
", its 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom" is an absolute phrase that is modifying " Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life".
Whats the OA and the source?
-s



I have few questions from you-
I normally put other rules to secondary position and judge with what Ron emphasizes so much:

and should complete the laundry list
and should connect two clauses
and can also connect two similar phrases
If we ignore idiomatic error for a while in C, can we discard C as and is unable to connect two part with exactly same tenses.
first part has continuous tense and in second part the tense is not continuous.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 05 Dec 2014, 03:21
honchos wrote:
If we ignore idiomatic error for a while in C, can we discard C as and is unable to connect two part with exactly same tenses.

Actually this is not a requirement that parts connected by and should be in the same tense.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 17 Apr 2015, 11:43
souvik101990 wrote:
With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.


A. Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with
comma+and introduces a new clause, but this new clause does not have a verb.

B. Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its
this answer choice changes comma+and to its. now we have a noun+noun modifier which correctly modifies Jupiter's Moon Europa.

C. Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has
2 clauses are connected only by and.

D. Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its
now long considered.. serves as a modifier, but after this modifier we have comma+and

E. Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have
same error as in D. In addition, with this choice, the sentence does not have a verb.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 02 Jan 2017, 23:48
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ezinis wrote:
:) Need explanation


The sentence says that Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life.
Option D and E are straightaway out it breaks the sentence by introducing the (,).
Option A is wrong considering 'with' preposition.

We are now left with option B and C. Ideally on first look C seems to be correct however it is not.
The sentence says that Jupiter's moon europa is too cold to support life and it gives reason why it too cold.
Because "its 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom....". We used "and" to connect two different statement. However in above we are just providing addition piece of information or reason. Hence B is the correct answer.
Although i did initially checked C and i was wrong.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 16 Jun 2017, 10:21
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Hey Sid,

I'd prefer if you didn't do that. While the forums are meant to be a place for people to discuss any material out there (including ours), it's not a place to simply share out all the material we have just so others can see it. Seek, if you want full access to all that stuff, all you need to do is buy the SC guide, which is very reasonably priced! Or, if you're really insistent, merely by searching the forums (here and elsewhere), you can probably find many of our questions discussed somewhere or another. : )

-tommy



Sorry to ask but I rejected B speifically because of the 'its' used in the question. As the pronoun refers back to a possessive antecedent should it not simply refer to Jupiter's rather than Europa. My construction leads to an illogical inference that Jupiter has ice. Hence, I rejected this answer choice.

Can you please explain how is its used to refer to Europa?
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 08 Jul 2017, 00:49
daagh
Hi Daagh, can you kindly help with the following:
1. Would C be grammatically correct if it had not added "as" after "considered"?
2. Would A be correct if the "and" is removed: "With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."

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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 08 Jul 2017, 05:33
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mailabhishekmathur wrote

Quote:
Sorry to ask but I rejected B specifically because of the 'its' used in the question. As the pronoun refers back to a possessive antecedent should it not simply refer to Jupiter's rather than Europa. My construction leads to an illogical inference that Jupiter has ice. Hence, I rejected this answer choice.

Can you please explain how is its used to refer to Europa?


Hi

Jupiter's' is not the subject here. Jupiter's moon (Europa) is the subject. 'Jupiter's' is simply an adjective.
A possessive pronoun (its) noun can certainly stand for a non- possessive noun (Europa). Only the reverse cannot happen.


Kerin wrote

Quote:
Hi Daagh, can you kindly help with the following:

1. Would C be grammatically correct if it had not added "as" after "considered"?

2. Would A be correct if the "and" is removed:
"With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom."


Kerin
Hi
1. Yes, C is correct the way you suggest
2. We are now getting into a slightly more complicated situation of adverbial modifiers started by 'with.
With denotes a certain level of physical accompaniment. In this case, even though the 'with' modifier at the end of the sentence modifies the entire clause before it as an absolute phrase, still the absolute phrase is not contributing to the clause. In addition, the preposition 'with' may modify a noun but not an elaborate action. Probably a simple appositive would have provided the additional meaning the as effectively and that is the reason B wins over A.


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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 09 Sep 2017, 10:08
With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with
- why is "and with" here? "and with" sets up something else, as if there's some sort of a list. that's not what is happening here.

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its
- correct as is

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has
- "considered as" = UNIDIOMATIC. PROPER IDIOM: "considered X" or "X is considered Y"

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its
- same as "D"

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have
- same as "A". "and to have" = completely wrong

i think the key thing here is that the phrase after "support life" = a modifier, so it should not be connected to the preceding phrase with "and ...".

Kudos please if you find helpful :)
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 20 Oct 2017, 01:08
ykaiim wrote:
Source : GMATPrep Default Exam Pack

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have


Let me try to help on this one.

As far as the idiomatic usage, considered as is non idiomatic. But consider to be or consider without a preposition is an idiomatic usage.

I also want to highlight on the usage of [with]+[noun]+[participle] construction. The sentence begins with this construction and this construction is used correctly as a prepositional modifier modifying Jupiter's moon Europa in this sentence. Though its a part of the non-underlined portion but I wanted to highlight on that part.
For more details on the usage of [with]+[noun]+[participle] construction, please refer, https://magoosh.com/gmat/2015/with-noun-participle-on-gmat-sentence-correction/

Now coming to the answer choices, POE works the best,

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with
Usage of ", and" is to connect two independent clauses. But we have only one independent clause - Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life. The second independent clause is missing. Also the other usage of ", and" is to connect more than 2 elements in a list, which is also not the case here. So usage of ", and" is wrong here. Therefore, incorrect.


(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its
Here, the part after the comma, its 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom is a NOUN + NOUN Modifier modifying the preceding clause. Correct. The intended meaning is that Europa is too cold to support life; a proof given to this effect is that its 60 square miles of water is thought to be frozen from top to bottom. This is clearly justified through the usage of NOUN + NOUN Modifier.

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has
Considered as is not idiomatic. ALso, in this sentence, the intended meaning is lost. We are not saying 2 things in the sentence. Instead we are saying only one thing which is supported by a modifier. Therefore, C has a meaning issue. The intended meaning is that Europa is too cold to support life; a proof given to this effect is that its 60 square miles of water is thought to be frozen from top to bottom.
However, C uses and hence seems to incorrectly suggest two independent things about Europa:
i) Europa is too cold to support life
ii) Europa has 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom. Therefore, incorrect.



(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its
There is no verb for the main subject Europa. Usage of Considered as is not idiomatic. Here also, the intended meaning is lost as in option C. Incorrect.

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have
It also repeats the similar errors as option D.
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J  [#permalink]

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New post 19 Nov 2017, 02:39
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ykaiim wrote:
Source : GMATPrep Default Exam Pack

With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water thought to be frozen from top to bottom.

(A) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with

(B) Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, its

(C) Europa has long been considered as far too cold to support life and has

(D) Europa, long considered as far too cold to support life, and its

(E) Europa, long considered to be far too cold to support life, and to have


In this question, and is not required as the portion after and is a modifier to Europa ___to support life. Clause 1 and 2 are hitting against each other and hence, D and E are wrong.

Answer B
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Re: With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Fahrenheit, J &nbs [#permalink] 19 Nov 2017, 02:39

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