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605-655 Level|   Modifiers|   Pronouns|   Subject Verb Agreement|                  
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leeye84
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are


https://www.nytimes.com/1983/01/16/us/in-farm-belt-fear-of-foreclosures-rises.html

Bankers here say that loan delinquencies, already triple what they were a year ago, could reach 10 times normal levels. Meanwhile, declining values for farm equipment and land - the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season - is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Question1:
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

In E what does the appositive "collateral" really modify - "declining values..." or "farm equipment and land".

Question2:
If I changed (D) to the below

(D) which farmers use as collateral to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

Now from the above two which would you choose as the answer?

Cheers
Gmatrant

Hi VeritasKarishma CrackVerbalGMAT GMATNinja egmat GMATNinjaTwo manhattan Magoosh

Please help.
Does "which" in option D refers to "Declining values" since "farm equipment and land" is under prepositional phrase("for...") or "which" in option D refers to "farm equipment and land"? Also, does the use of word "collateral" and "borrow" simultaneously in a sentence correct as someone pointed out in explanation that use of both word simultaneously is a redundant thing.
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leeye84
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are


https://www.nytimes.com/1983/01/16/us/in-farm-belt-fear-of-foreclosures-rises.html

Bankers here say that loan delinquencies, already triple what they were a year ago, could reach 10 times normal levels. Meanwhile, declining values for farm equipment and land - the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season - is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Question1:
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

In E what does the appositive "collateral" really modify - "declining values..." or "farm equipment and land".

Question2:
If I changed (D) to the below

(D) which farmers use as collateral to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

Now from the above two which would you choose as the answer?

Cheers
Gmatrant

Hi VeritasKarishma CrackVerbalGMAT GMATNinja egmat GMATNinjaTwo manhattan Magoosh

Please help.
Does "which" in option D refers to "Declining values" since "farm equipment and land" is under prepositional phrase("for...") or "which" in option D refers to "farm equipment and land"? Also, does the use of word "collateral" and "borrow" simultaneously in a sentence correct as someone pointed out in explanation that use of both word simultaneously is a redundant thing.
When "which" follows a noun phrase that involves a preposition, there's no rule that tells us what it's describing. We have to use logic.

Here, it makes more sense for "which" to refer to "equipment and land" as "declining values" pretty clearly couldn't be used as collateral. So "which" isn't inherently wrong here.

And I wouldn't say that "borrow" and "collateral" are redundant. After all, they both show up in every option.

The issues with (D) can be seen most clearly by doing a side-by-side comparison with (E). In (D) the land and equipment are described by the modifier "which farmers use as collateral..." But why use the clunky phrase, "which farmers use as collateral" when you could just call the land and equipment "collateral" directly, as (E) does?

Also, the first time I read (D), I stumbled over the phrase "collateral to borrow," thinking for a moment that the farmers were borrowing collateral, an interpretation that makes no sense. If you read (D) again in its entirety, you can see that this isn't what the writer means, but (E) gets rid of the problematic phrase entirely and spares the reader this confusion.

So I wouldn't say that (D) has a definitive error, necessarily, but (E) is clearer and more concise, and therefore better.

I hope that helps!
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leeye84
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are


https://www.nytimes.com/1983/01/16/us/in-farm-belt-fear-of-foreclosures-rises.html

Bankers here say that loan delinquencies, already triple what they were a year ago, could reach 10 times normal levels. Meanwhile, declining values for farm equipment and land - the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season - is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

Question1:
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

In E what does the appositive "collateral" really modify - "declining values..." or "farm equipment and land".

Question2:
If I changed (D) to the below

(D) which farmers use as collateral to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

Now from the above two which would you choose as the answer?

Cheers
Gmatrant

Hi VeritasKarishma CrackVerbalGMAT GMATNinja egmat GMATNinjaTwo manhattan Magoosh

Please help.
Does "which" in option D refers to "Declining values" since "farm equipment and land" is under prepositional phrase("for...") or "which" in option D refers to "farm equipment and land"? Also, does the use of word "collateral" and "borrow" simultaneously in a sentence correct as someone pointed out in explanation that use of both word simultaneously is a redundant thing.
When "which" follows a noun phrase that involves a preposition, there's no rule that tells us what it's describing. We have to use logic.

Here, it makes more sense for "which" to refer to "equipment and land" as "declining values" pretty clearly couldn't be used as collateral. So "which" isn't inherently wrong here.

And I wouldn't say that "borrow" and "collateral" are redundant. After all, they both show up in every option.

The issues with (D) can be seen most clearly by doing a side-by-side comparison with (E). In (D) the land and equipment are described by the modifier "which farmers use as collateral..." But why use the clunky phrase, "which farmers use as collateral" when you could just call the land and equipment "collateral" directly, as (E) does?

Also, the first time I read (D), I stumbled over the phrase "collateral to borrow," thinking for a moment that the farmers were borrowing collateral, an interpretation that makes no sense. If you read (D) again in its entirety, you can see that this isn't what the writer means, but (E) gets rid of the problematic phrase entirely and spares the reader this confusion.

So I wouldn't say that (D) has a definitive error, necessarily, but (E) is clearer and more concise, and therefore better.

I hope that helps!

Thank you GMATNinja for the reply
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https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-depres ... 18708.html

In this question "property values" is plural, and here "Declining values" has a verb "is", which is singular.
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https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-depressed-property-values-can-hurt-some-large-investors-they-18708.html

In this question "property values" is plural, and here "Declining values" has a verb "is", which is singular.

Please shed some light on "values"! GMATNinja egmat
Hi vishnugmatgupta,

There's an are at the end of the correct option.
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vishnugmatgupta
https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-depressed-property-values-can-hurt-some-large-investors-they-18708.html

In this question "property values" is plural, and here "Declining values" has a verb "is", which is singular.

Please shed some light on "values"! GMATNinja egmat
Hi vishnugmatgupta,

There's an are at the end of the correct option.


Oh yes! i am so sorry!!….Thanks🙌🏼

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Hi AjiteshArun DmitryFarber MartyTargetTestPrep sayantanc2k
In E – I don’t understand the usage of the word “collateral - against”

Shouldn’t the usage be “as collateral”
- I used my car as collateral to get a loan
- I put up my home as collateral to get a loan

Is collateral against : some sort of passive voice usage perhaps ?

[/quote]
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Hi ReedArnoldMPREP sayantanc2k - i eliminated option E because i thought - "Collateral" could be referring to either Values or Equipment and Land

Now i know -- if i go one step further and say -- values can technically never be collateral -- So, i am left with equipment and land as the only logical referrant to collateral.

But you should never have to do that 'extra' work for the sentence (per my understanding)

-- i eliminated E because based on the structure -- there are 2 antecedents for 'collateral' in option E.

Even though, Equipment and Land makes more sense to be the logical referant than Values does for the word "collateral" -- one shouldnt do this 'extra work' for a SC sentence.

Thoughts ?
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Hi AjiteshArun DmitryFarber MartyTargetTestPrep sayantanc2k
In E – I don’t understand the usage of the word “collateral - against”

Shouldn’t the usage be “as collateral”
- I used my car as collateral to get a loan
- I put up my home as collateral to get a loan

Is collateral against : some sort of passive voice usage perhaps ?


Hello jabhatta2,

We hope this finds you well.

To answer your query, in this sentence "the collateral against which" is, indeed, a modifying phrase in the passive voice.

We hope this helps.
All the best!
Experts' Global Team
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jabhatta2
Hi - In E – I don’t understand the usage of the word “collateral - against”

Shouldn’t the usage be “as collateral”
- I used my car as collateral to get a loan
- I put up my home as collateral to get a loan

Is collateral against : some sort of passive voice usage perhaps ?


Hello jabhatta2,

We hope this finds you well.

To answer your query, in this sentence "the collateral against which" is, indeed, a modifying phrase in the passive voice.

We hope this helps.
All the best!
Experts' Global Team

Hi ExpertsGlobal5 - how would you convert these 2 sentence (which i think are active voice) into passive voice

Will you "against collateral" ?

Quote:

Active voice - I used my car as collateral to get a loan
Active voice - I put up my home as collateral to get a loan
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jabhatta2
Hi - In E – I don’t understand the usage of the word “collateral - against”

Shouldn’t the usage be “as collateral”
- I used my car as collateral to get a loan
- I put up my home as collateral to get a loan

Is collateral against : some sort of passive voice usage perhaps ?


Hello jabhatta2,

We hope this finds you well.

To answer your query, in this sentence "the collateral against which" is, indeed, a modifying phrase in the passive voice.

We hope this helps.
All the best!
Experts' Global Team

Hi ExpertsGlobal5 - how would you convert these 2 sentence (which i think are active voice) into passive voice

Will you "against collateral" ?

Quote:

Active voice - I used my car as collateral to get a loan
Active voice - I put up my home as collateral to get a loan

Hello jabhatta2,

We hope this finds you well.

To provide some clarity here, "collateral against which" is a phrase that is passive in nature, but it is not necessary or even desirable to use it in the passive versions of the sentences you have given.

The most straightforward passive versions of these sentences are: "My car was used as collateral by me to get a loan." and "My home was put up as collateral by me to get a loan."

If we were to use the phrase "collateral against which", the most straightforward versions of these sentences would be: "My car is the collateral against which I got a loan." and "My home is the collateral against which I got a loan."

We hope this helps.
All the best!
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Hi ReedArnoldMPREP sayantanc2k - i eliminated option E because i thought - "Collateral" could be referring to either Values or Equipment and Land

Now i know -- if i go one step further and say -- values can technically never be collateral -- So, i am left with equipment and land as the only logical referrant to collateral.

But you should never have to do that 'extra' work for the sentence (per my understanding)

-- i eliminated E because based on the structure -- there are 2 antecedents for 'collateral' in option E.

Even though, Equipment and Land makes more sense to be the logical referant than Values does for the word "collateral" -- one shouldnt do this 'extra work' for a SC sentence.

Thoughts ?

I'm cautious with absolutes in SC. Language is imperfect. I'm also cautious about ambiguity splits in SC. They're a last resort. You're doing a good job making structure the primary focus of your analysis, to come up with a question like this. This is one of those times where I'd say, "Okay, great, now dial the 'robot' part back a little bit."
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Hi ReedArnoldMPREP sayantanc2k - i eliminated option E because i thought - "Collateral" could be referring to either Values or Equipment and Land

Now i know -- if i go one step further and say -- values can technically never be collateral -- So, i am left with equipment and land as the only logical referrant to collateral.

But you should never have to do that 'extra' work for the sentence (per my understanding)

-- i eliminated E because based on the structure -- there are 2 antecedents for 'collateral' in option E.

Even though, Equipment and Land makes more sense to be the logical referant than Values does for the word "collateral" -- one shouldnt do this 'extra work' for a SC sentence.

Thoughts ?

Hello jabhatta2,

We hope this finds you well.

To answer your query, in this case, you are not really doing any "extra work" because it is blatantly clear that "Values" cannot be "collateral"; the ambiguity of meaning is not a concern if one potential meaning is blatantly nonsensical.

For example: "The brothers own two cars, and they are electric."

Here, there is no ambiguity regarding what "they" refers to, since "brothers" cannot possibly be "electric".

We hope this helps.
All the best!
Experts' Global Team
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leeye84
Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

When "which" follows a noun phrase that involves a preposition, there's no rule that tells us what it's describing. We have to use logic.

Here, it makes more sense for "which" to refer to "equipment and land" as "declining values" pretty clearly couldn't be used as collateral. So "which" isn't inherently wrong here.

And I wouldn't say that "borrow" and "collateral" are redundant. After all, they both show up in every option.

The issues with (D) can be seen most clearly by doing a side-by-side comparison with (E). In (D) the land and equipment are described by the modifier "which farmers use as collateral..." But why use the clunky phrase, "which farmers use as collateral" when you could just call the land and equipment "collateral" directly, as (E) does?

Also, the first time I read (D), I stumbled over the phrase "collateral to borrow," thinking for a moment that the farmers were borrowing collateral, an interpretation that makes no sense. If you read (D) again in its entirety, you can see that this isn't what the writer means, but (E) gets rid of the problematic phrase entirely and spares the reader this confusion.

So I wouldn't say that (D) has a definitive error, necessarily, but (E) is clearer and more concise, and therefore better.

I hope that helps!

Thank you for the explanation, Ninja. I've benefitted a lot from your explanations to various questions, and I really feel that my thought process in solving questions are quite similar to yours. Though there's something still unclear to me here in this particular question.

It is the 'equipment and land' that farmers borrow against as collaterals, and not the 'declining value', therefore:

in D) ',in which' accurately points the modifier phrase towards 'equipment and land' the closest noun in the preceding clause,
in E) starting with 'the collateral against' sounds to me like that modifier phrase is modifying "declining values in equipment and land", since it is the main subject of the entire sentence and thus the target? or at least it's ambiguous what the phrase is modifying (declining value or 'equipment and land').

Wouldn't D be the more concise sentence structure of the two? Please let me know where I'm wrong in the concept. Really appreciate it if you could clarify further!
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Declining values for farm equipment and land, the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is going to force many lenders to tighten or deny credit this spring.

(A) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, is
(B) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, is
(C) the collateral which is borrowed against by farmers to get through the harvest season, is
(D) which farmers use as collateral to borrow against to get through the harvest season, are
(E) the collateral against which farmers borrow to get through the harvest season, are

When "which" follows a noun phrase that involves a preposition, there's no rule that tells us what it's describing. We have to use logic.

Here, it makes more sense for "which" to refer to "equipment and land" as "declining values" pretty clearly couldn't be used as collateral. So "which" isn't inherently wrong here.

And I wouldn't say that "borrow" and "collateral" are redundant. After all, they both show up in every option.

The issues with (D) can be seen most clearly by doing a side-by-side comparison with (E). In (D) the land and equipment are described by the modifier "which farmers use as collateral..." But why use the clunky phrase, "which farmers use as collateral" when you could just call the land and equipment "collateral" directly, as (E) does?

Also, the first time I read (D), I stumbled over the phrase "collateral to borrow," thinking for a moment that the farmers were borrowing collateral, an interpretation that makes no sense. If you read (D) again in its entirety, you can see that this isn't what the writer means, but (E) gets rid of the problematic phrase entirely and spares the reader this confusion.

So I wouldn't say that (D) has a definitive error, necessarily, but (E) is clearer and more concise, and therefore better.

I hope that helps!

Thank you for the explanation, Ninja. I've benefitted a lot from your explanations to various questions, and I really feel that my thought process in solving questions are quite similar to yours. Though there's something still unclear to me here in this particular question.

It is the 'equipment and land' that farmers borrow against as collaterals, and not the 'declining value', therefore:

in D) ',in which' accurately points the modifier phrase towards 'equipment and land' the closest noun in the preceding clause,
in E) starting with 'the collateral against' sounds to me like that modifier phrase is modifying "declining values in equipment and land", since it is the main subject of the entire sentence and thus the target? or at least it's ambiguous what the phrase is modifying (declining value or 'equipment and land').

Wouldn't D be the more concise sentence structure of the two? Please let me know where I'm wrong in the concept. Really appreciate it if you could clarify further!
The "which" in (D) and the "the collateral" in (E) seem to be equally clear in terms of what they modify. Both refer to the phrase right next to them: "the farm equipment and land."

You're right that anytime a noun modifier is next to the construction, NOUN + PREPOSITIONAL PHRASE, the modifier could refer to either the original noun (declining values) or one within the prepositional phrase (equipment and land), but that's true of both "which" and "the collateral." And generally, if it makes sense for a noun modifier to describe the thing it's right next to, we can't treat it as an error.

So if the placement of both modifiers is okay, what it really comes down is a choice between using the modifier in (D), "which farmers use as collateral," and using the modifier in (E), "the collateral." Seems pretty clear that (E) is the more concise of the two, right? Toss in the potentially confusing meaning in (D) -- are the farmers borrowing collateral? -- and (E) has the edge.

I hope that helps a bit!
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Hi Ashish,

Please explain why is D incorrect and E correct.
Couple of issues with D:

a) At the very least, "which" is ambiguous, since it is not clear whether "which" is modifying "land" or "equipment and land". In fact, for the most part, "which" is not likely to ever modify a "list" ("equipment and land" in this case).

b) "which farmers use as collateral to borrow against" does not conform with GMAT‘s stylistic preference. Modifier clauses (especially relative clauses) should not end with a preposition. Here, this clause ends in a preposition "against".

Hi EducationAisle

I chose option D instead of E, because in E, it seems like the decline of equipment and land is used as collateral rather that the equipment and land themselves. Use of which, though slightly ambiguous, makes it clear that the land is used as a collateral.

What is wrong with my understanding ?
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Hi EducationAisle

I chose option D instead of E, because in E, it seems like the decline of equipment and land is used as collateral rather that the equipment and land themselves.
For one thing, I don't see the phrase "decline of equipment and land" in E at all.

In option E, "the collateral" is used as (what's called) an appositive and it is the property of appositives that they modify the word or phrase next to it. Here, that phrase is "farm equipment and land".

p.s. Our book EducationAisle Sentence Correction Nirvana discusses Appositives, their application and examples in significant detail. If you or someone is interested, PM me your email-id; I can mail the corresponding section.
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