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The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed

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Re: The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed  [#permalink]

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New post 02 Nov 2017, 21:29
In one of his videos, Ron Purewal says that "including" doesn't work like any other verb-ing, and that "including" modifies the noun before the comma.
Can someone clarify this?
see around the 57-minute mark.
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New post 03 Nov 2017, 09:58
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DIII wrote:
In one of his videos, Ron Purewal says that "including" doesn't work like any other verb-ing, and that "including" modifies the noun before the comma.
Can someone clarify this?

Dear DIII,

I'm happy to respond. :-)

The great Mr. Ron Purewal is certainly a genius, but I am going to disagree slightly. :-)

First of all, modifying the previous noun is not categorically unlike any other present participle. Participles are very flexible, sometimes acting as noun modifier and sometimes, as verb modifiers. Certainly there are instances in which we find [noun] [comma] [present participle} when the participle is acting as a modifier for the noun.
When I walked in, I saw the detective, leaning against a pillar and smoking a cigarette.
Of course, that's less a GMAT SC sentence and more one from a tawdry thriller novel, but the grammar is the same.

Also, I would say that, for the majority of the time, the participle "including" acts as a noun modifier and modifies the noun it touches. Occasionally, a vital noun modifier would come between the participle and the target noun, and it is possible that this vital noun modifier is a long clause. That's precisely what is happening in the OA of this question.
(E) The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.
Notice that the purple part, from "that" to "authenticity," is a giant adjectival clause, a noun-modifying clause, all modifying the phrase "printed instructions." That phrase is the target of the participle "including."

Usually, when the word "including" is going to be used as a verb modifier, it's in the gerund form following the preposition "by."
Maxwell described the first unified field, electromagnetism, by including Faraday's Law and expanding Ampere's Law.

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)
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New post 03 Nov 2017, 10:12
Thank you, makes sense now.
Do you think "which" can also modify in a similar way (by skipping over a vital modifier)?
I sometimes get confused about the exceptions in the usage of "which".
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New post 03 Nov 2017, 13:21
DIII wrote:
Thank you, makes sense now.
Do you think "which" can also modify in a similar way (by skipping over a vital modifier)?
I sometimes get confused about the exceptions in the usage of "which".

Dear DIII,

I'm happy to respond. :-)

Yes. In fact, any noun modifier can skip over a vital modifier for the same noun. See:
Modifiers on the GMAT Sentence Correction

Mike :-)
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New post 03 Nov 2017, 13:24
DIII wrote:
Thank you, makes sense now.
Do you think "which" can also modify in a similar way (by skipping over a vital modifier)?
I sometimes get confused about the exceptions in the usage of "which".




Hello DIII,

I will be glad to help you out with this one. :-)

Yes. all the noun modifiers can be used the way including has been used in the correct answer choice of the relevant official sentence. At e-GMAT, we call such modification a slightly far-away noun modification by a noun modifier.

In fact, we have authored a very famous article on the topic that includes details, examples, a exceptions to the usage of such modification. You can review this article named Noun Modifiers can Modify slightly far away noun in the following link:
https://gmatclub.com/forum/noun-modifiers-can-modify-slightly-far-away-noun-135868.html

Also, here is my two cents on the usage of including on GMAT SC.

It is true that comma + verb-ing modifiers modify the preceding action. But including is an exception to this rule. Preceded by a comma or not and placed after a clause or not, including works as a noun modifier only.

There are several GMAT SC that uses including as a noun modifier only.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
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New post 15 Jan 2019, 10:32
@GMATNinja:-Hi Gmatninja, I'm absolutely confused between C & E, i read in this thread that by is never used with a comma, is this always true?

Secondly is reminders for watching,viewing wrong? should it always be to reminders to?
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New post 18 Jan 2019, 01:40
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


lets talk about INCLUDING.
"including" here work as a preposition, but not as a verb-ing. "including+words=prepositional phrase. this preposition phrase can modify a noun, which is "instructions" .
in English, there are many words which look like verbs (present participle or past participle) but works as a preposition or conjunction, such as " as compared to", "including", "regarding", "considering" or "provided that" . of course, "compared to" can still be a verb. this means "compared to" can be both a preposition and a participle of a verb.

comma+doing can modify the previous clause. prepositional phrase can modify a noun.

one of important skills for sc section is to learn from the official answers.

"including phrase" inhere is very far from "instruction". this is the lession we need to know. of course, we like near modification but if there is no answer choices better, far modification is not incorrect.

many noun modifier can be a little far from its headword. but "including" is special in that it can be very far from the modified noun. my "very far" means "including" phrase can jump over a clause while normal far modifier can jump over only a noun phrase. look at choice E to see that "including" phrase jump over "that the company hopes...".

the takeaway is that "including " phrase is a very far noun modification.
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New post 20 Jan 2019, 04:18
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view --> authenticity cannot includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures doesn't make any sense

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view --> authenticity cannot includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures doesn't make any sense

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing --> to watch, comparing signatures and viewing are not parallel

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


HI GMATNinja,

In E how does including refers to printed instructions but not the nearest noun that is Company?
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New post 25 Jan 2019, 12:49
NandishSS wrote:
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view --> authenticity cannot includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures doesn't make any sense

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view --> authenticity cannot includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures doesn't make any sense

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing --> to watch, comparing signatures and viewing are not parallel

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


HI GMATNinja,

In E how does including refers to printed instructions but not the nearest noun that is Company?

Good question! This is a good reminder that anytime we have the following construction: NOUN + NOUN MODIFIER + COMMA + NOUN MODIFIER, the second noun modifier might refer either to the first noun modifier or to the original noun. You have to use logic and context to determine which.

In this case, our noun is the "series of printed instructions." The first modifier ("that the company hopes will help...") describes the series of printed instructions, and so we have to ask ourselves what the second modifier ("including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures...") is logically referring to. It makes sense for the instructions to include these reminders; it really doesn't make sense for the company to include reminders.

Takeaway: though the touch "rule" generally works, be careful about applying it too rigidly, since there are plenty of exceptions. It's better to ask whether the modifier is reasonably close to a logical referent. (And you can find a brief discussion of exceptions to the "touch rule" -- specifically in the context of modifiers beginning with "that" -- in this article and this video.)

I hope this helps!
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New post 01 Feb 2019, 06:32
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Why C is wrong ?
I understand there is a subtle change in meaning with C But how do we know the intended meaning
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New post 01 Feb 2019, 08:25
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Why C is wrong?
I understand there is a subtle change in meaning with C But how do we know the intended meaning



(
Quote:
C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing
(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


Perhaps you will agree that the redesigning was done for some purpose. That intended purpose is the original meaning indicator and that intention is best expressed by an infinitive of purpose, but not by indicative gerund. That is the difference between E and C.
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New post 08 Mar 2019, 20:34
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view - "which" is modifying check's authenticity, which is wrong

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view - "which" is modifying check's authenticity, which is wrong

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing - for watching is inferior to "to watch"

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing - Not parallel

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view - Parallel


E is the correct answer
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New post 05 May 2019, 04:40
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


chetan2u , VeritasKarishma , GMATNinja , egmat,

Will you please explain this SC question ?
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New post 08 May 2019, 08:00
What's wrong in saying that "The feature will help merchants confirm a check's authenticity, which includes..."
I mean which here modifies authenticity and what's wrong in it? Can't we consider that reminders to watch the endorsement/compare signatures etc... under authenticity?
On the other way, if I wanted to modify authenticity how I can do that. I believe that/which should suffice. Please assist me what am I missing.
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New post 21 May 2019, 00:54
quantum wrote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view



permit me to post second time. my posting this time contradict with my previous posting.

including can work as an adverb, which refer to subject of the previous clause and modifies the previous clause. the previous clause is " that (instructions) will help merchant confirm".

why including can not work as an adverb here. ? it is quite good for including to do so.

if including works as an adjective here, including is too far from "instructions".

though some noun modifier can modify a slightly far noun, modifying too far noun is a problem.

second thing is

if including can modify a far noun, why "which clause" in choice A and B can not do so. the reason for which we eliminate choice A and B is that "which clause" is too far from the noun modified.

I conclude that "including" in choice E works as an adverb, not adjective".

instructions help merchants confirm authenticity, including the reminders to watch endorsement.

I think this sentence is good.

am i correct?
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Re: The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed  [#permalink]

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New post 29 May 2019, 13:36
krishnabalu wrote:
What's wrong in saying that "The feature will help merchants confirm a check's authenticity, which includes..."
I mean which here modifies authenticity and what's wrong in it? Can't we consider that reminders to watch the endorsement/compare signatures etc... under authenticity?
On the other way, if I wanted to modify authenticity how I can do that. I believe that/which should suffice. Please assist me what am I missing.

"Including" typically designates membership in a group, so when we encounter this construction, our job is go back and see if there's a group that the relevant elements can be part of.

Take another look at (E): "The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing the watermark while holding the check to the light." So now have to ask ourselves: what group are these "reminders" a part of? Scanning back, we can see that "the series of printed instructions" must be the group that contains the "reminders." Nothing else really makes sense.

As for how you'd modify, "authenticity," the answer is any way you want, so long as it's logical. "Authenticity" can't contain reminders - this is how we know that the modifier "including" must refer to something else. However, I could write something like, "The check's authenticity, which has been verified by dozens of experts, is no longer in doubt." Now it makes perfect sense for "which" to refer to "authenticity," because it's logical for authenticity to be verified by experts.

The takeaway: do not try to memorize every scenario about how modifiers can potentially work! Once you've absorbed what kind of modifiers describe nouns and what kind describe actions or clauses, just bear in mind two questions: 1) is the modifier reasonably close to the thing it's describing? and 2) is the construction logical? The only way to answer those questions is to consider context and meaning.

I hope that helps!
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New post 29 May 2019, 21:53
Quote:
The principal feature of the redesigned checks is a series of printed instructions that the company hopes will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark while holding the check to the light.


(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view

(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view

(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing

(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing

(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view


The right answer here should be E.

The first step is to note that the pronoun "which" refers to the noun before. So A & B are OUT, since it is not the authenticity that is including anything.

C - "including reminders for watching" is incorrect, if you have two verbs in the same tense together the second one must be in the infinitive, so "reminders to watch"

D - This is simply not parallel. "to watch" and "comparing" dont go together.

Hence E is correct.
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New post 05 Jun 2019, 18:05
... printed instructions ... will help merchants confirm a check’s authenticity, which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view the watermark ...

(A) which includes reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view
(B) which include reminders for watching the endorsement, to compare signatures and view
(C) by including reminders for watching the endorsement, comparing signatures, and viewing
(D) including reminders to watch the endorsement, comparing signatures and viewing
(E) including reminders to watch the endorsement, compare signatures, and view

1) which vs. by including/including
A) & B) relative pronoun "which" refers back to the preceding noun, which is "authenticity." These ACs wrongly state that the "authenticity" is what includes the features, rather than the "printed instructions"
C) is wrong because "by including" makes it sound like the "printed instructions" are doing the action of "including"
B) & C) "reminders for" is wrong, needs "to" instead (reminder to do X)

2) Parallel lists
D) is wrong because you cannot mix infinitive "to watch" with participles "comparing" & "viewing"
E) correct use of participle "including" to modify previous clause & correct parallel structure
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