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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some

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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 04 Feb 2013, 13:13
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A
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them have a population less than 10,000.
(A) of which some of them have
(B) some of which having
(C) some of them having
(D) some of them have
(E) some of which to have


This question explores both absolute phrases and subgroup modifiers. For more on absolute phrases, as well as a complete explanation of this question, see:
http://magoosh.com/gmat/2013/absolute-p ... -the-gmat/

Mike :-)

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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties [#permalink]

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New post 04 Feb 2013, 14:17
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties [#permalink]

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New post 04 Feb 2013, 17:58
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them have a population less than 10,000.
(A) of which some of them have
(B) some of which having
(C) some of them having
(D) some of them have
(E) some of which to have

+1 kudo sir. I liked this question.
I was between C and D, but chose C correctly as dependent clause will not have its individual verb.
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 14 Feb 2014, 09:43
Can someone explain the difference between B and C? Which vs them rule

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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 14 Feb 2014, 10:16
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carrillo1228 wrote:
Can someone explain the difference between B and C? Which vs them rule

Dear carrillo1228,
I'm happy to respond. :-) I don't know whether you read the OE, at the link given in the top post in this thread.

Here's the basic idea. The word "which" is a relative pronoun. It introduces a subordinate clause and acts as the subject of that clause. Thus, the word "which" always needs a 100% bonafide full verb following it. If there were an option with a full verb after "which", that would be correct ---- that's what many test-takers would expect, and the fact that this option is not available is part of what is tricky about this question. It would be perfectly correct to say -----
The state of California contains 58 counties, some of which have a population less than 10,000.
That's completely correct, but not an option here. You see, choice (B) has "which" + [participle}, which is never a legitimate structure. The structure in (C), with the ordinary pronoun "them" + [participle] ---- that is a legitimate structure: an absolute phrase, discuss in the link in that first post.

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 14 Feb 2014, 10:31
Hi Mike,

This completely makes sense.

This goes back to the "which - noun" way of remembering things..... in that the word 'which' needs a noun....

Got it.

Many thanks for your fast reply!
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 14 Feb 2014, 13:14
Hey Mike,

I was wondering why is D not an acceptable answer for this question? Thanks.
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 14 Feb 2014, 21:15
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Qjones818 wrote:
Hey Mike,

I was wondering why is D not an acceptable answer for this question? Thanks.

Dear Qjones818,
This is also tricky. The second clause would be flawless in version (D), but the sentence would be a run-on sentence. We can separate one independent clause from another purely with a comma. We need a conjunction (and, but, or, for, yet, ...) or a strong break in punctuation (semicolon, colon, dash). See:
https://gmat.magoosh.com/lessons/916-run-on-sentences

Does this make sense?
Mike :-)
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 22 Mar 2015, 09:05
mikemcgarry wrote:
carrillo1228 wrote:
Can someone explain the difference between B and C? Which vs them rule

Dear carrillo1228,
I'm happy to respond. :-) I don't know whether you read the OE, at the link given in the top post in this thread.

Here's the basic idea. The word "which" is a relative pronoun. It introduces a subordinate clause and acts as the subject of that clause. Thus, the word "which" always needs a 100% bonafide full verb following it. If there were an option with a full verb after "which", that would be correct ---- that's what many test-takers would expect, and the fact that this option is not available is part of what is tricky about this question. It would be perfectly correct to say -----
The state of California contains 58 counties, some of which have a population less than 10,000.
That's completely correct, but not an option here. You see, choice (B) has "which" + [participle}, which is never a legitimate structure. The structure in (C), with the ordinary pronoun "them" + [participle] ---- that is a legitimate structure: an absolute phrase, discuss in the link in that first post.

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)



Thanks for explanation Mike. I was caught in between B & C. Now, it makes more sense.


Thanks Again :) :-D
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 12 Jul 2015, 07:46
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them have a population less than 10,000.

(A) of which some of them have
(B) some of which having
(C) some of them having
(D) some of them have
(E) some of which to have
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 12 Jul 2015, 08:06
A is redundant and awkward. B and E are clearly wrong. D is missing an "of" after population. So C IMO...
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 12 Jul 2015, 08:18
Can you explain why choice "C" is correct?

I am trying to put choice "C" in the original sentence and to move mofier before the main clause (so that there will be no change of meaning) and it doesn't make sense:

The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them having a population less than 10,000.

This sentence conveys the same meaning, since a verb-ing modifier put before the clause, can modify the clause:
Some of the counties having a population less than 10,000, The state of California contains 58 counties.

Doesn't work.
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post Updated on: 12 Jul 2015, 10:09
bakavoice wrote:
Can you explain why choice "C" is correct?

I am trying to put choice "C" in the original sentence and to move mofier before the main clause (so that there will be no change of meaning) and it doesn't make sense:

The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them having a population less than 10,000.

This sentence conveys the same meaning, since a verb-ing modifier put before the clause, can modify the clause:
Some of the counties having a population less than 10,000, The state of California contains 58 counties.

Doesn't work.


C does work. It's an absolute clause type sentence.

The state of California contains 58 counties. = Complete thought.
Some of them having a population less than 10,000 = Not a complete thought.

Similar to the sentence: "All things being equal, the best choice is C."

Originally posted by iPen on 12 Jul 2015, 10:02.
Last edited by iPen on 12 Jul 2015, 10:09, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 12 Jul 2015, 10:08
iPen wrote:
bakavoice wrote:
Can you explain why choice "C" is correct?

I am trying to put choice "C" in the original sentence and to move mofier before the main clause (so that there will be no change of meaning) and it doesn't make sense:

The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them having a population less than 10,000.

This sentence conveys the same meaning, since a verb-ing modifier put before the clause, can modify the clause:
Some of the counties having a population less than 10,000, The state of California contains 58 counties.

Doesn't work.


C does work. It's an absolute clause type sentence.


Thanks! I somehow skipped absolute constructions in my preparation.
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 01 Aug 2015, 10:09
mikemcgarry wrote:
carrillo1228 wrote:
Can someone explain the difference between B and C? Which vs them rule

Dear carrillo1228,
I'm happy to respond. :-) I don't know whether you read the OE, at the link given in the top post in this thread.

Here's the basic idea. The word "which" is a relative pronoun. It introduces a subordinate clause and acts as the subject of that clause. Thus, the word "which" always needs a 100% bonafide full verb following it. If there were an option with a full verb after "which", that would be correct ---- that's what many test-takers would expect, and the fact that this option is not available is part of what is tricky about this question. It would be perfectly correct to say -----
The state of California contains 58 counties, some of which have a population less than 10,000.
That's completely correct, but not an option here. You see, choice (B) has "which" + [participle}, which is never a legitimate structure. The structure in (C), with the ordinary pronoun "them" + [participle] ---- that is a legitimate structure: an absolute phrase, discuss in the link in that first post.

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)


Hey Mike, nice explanation.. I was wondering can we generalize this is a rule that a pronoun can never be followed by a participle?
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 03 Aug 2015, 13:26
Subanta wrote:

Hey Mike, nice explanation.. I was wondering can we generalize this is a rule that a pronoun can never be followed by a participle?

Dear Subanta,
I'm happy to respond. :-) Your question is unusual, because in the OA of this SC question, a pronoun IS followed by a participle.

(C) The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them having a population less than 10,000.
"them" = pronoun
"having" = participle
This is the OA and it is 100% correct.

We certainly can't generalize a rule against something that is true in this correct sentence.

My friend, I will caution you against looking for a "rule based" way to approach GMAT SC. Yes, there are a few valid rules, and several more guidelines, but one cannot rise to GMAT SC mastery by learning some complete set of rules. Grammar is not mathematics. There is an irreducible living quality to language. I will recommend this blog:
http://magoosh.com/gmat/2014/how-to-imp ... bal-score/

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 04 Aug 2015, 05:18
mikemcgarry wrote:
Subanta wrote:

Hey Mike, nice explanation.. I was wondering can we generalize this is a rule that a pronoun can never be followed by a participle?

Dear Subanta,
I'm happy to respond. :-) Your question is unusual, because in the OA of this SC question, a pronoun IS followed by a participle.

(C) The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them having a population less than 10,000.
"them" = pronoun
"having" = participle
This is the OA and it is 100% correct.

We certainly can't generalize a rule against something that is true in this correct sentence.

My friend, I will caution you against looking for a "rule based" way to approach GMAT SC. Yes, there are a few valid rules, and several more guidelines, but one cannot rise to GMAT SC mastery by learning some complete set of rules. Grammar is not mathematics. There is an irreducible living quality to language. I will recommend this blog:
http://magoosh.com/gmat/2014/how-to-imp ... bal-score/

Does all this make sense?
Mike :-)


Idioms have made my life easier in SC but I get your point! Thanks Mike!
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The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some [#permalink]

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New post 21 Mar 2017, 17:41
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mikemcgarry wrote:
The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them have a population less than 10,000.
(A) of which some of them have
(B) some of which having
(C) some of them having
(D) some of them have
(E) some of which to have


OFFICIAL SOLUTION



Here, we get clause construction as well as what is sometimes called a “subgroup modifier”.

The word “which” is a relative pronoun, and this means two important things. First, “which” begins a subordinate clause that, like any clause, must have a full [noun] + [verb] structure. Second, the pronoun “which” itself is the subject of this subordinate clause. Choices (B) & (E) run afoul of the first rule — they follow “which” with a participle and an infinitive respectively, not a full bonafide verb. Choice (A) has a bonafide verb, “have”, but it gets in trouble with the second rule — it has a double subject, the word “which” and the phrase “some of them” — this would be a like the sentence, “My sister she is smart” — the [noun] + [pronoun] structure is redundant and incorrect. Choice (A) makes exactly the same mistake. None of these three choices is correct.

The phrase “some of them” is a noun. If we follow a noun with a full verb “have”, as (D) does, this creates an independent clause —- everything after the comma could stand on its own as a complete sentence. Again, the problem is — we have [independent clause], [independent clause] — that’s the structure of a run-on sentence. Choice (D) makes this mistake and is not correct. Choice (C) follows the noun “some of them” with the participlehaving” — this is the [noun] + [participle] structure of an absolute phrase. This is grammatically correct, and because there’s a grave problem with each of the other four answer choices, (C) is the only possible answer.
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 28 Jul 2017, 01:22
Is there a better explanation as to why D is incorrect?
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha [#permalink]

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New post 28 Jul 2017, 01:49
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dhruv1911 wrote:
Is there a better explanation as to why D is incorrect?


Hi dhruv1911 ,

D is wrong because it is joining two independent clauses with a comma and no FANBOYS.

The state of California contains 58 counties, some of them have a population less than 10,000.

Does that make sense?
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Re: The state of California contains 58 counties, of which some of them ha   [#permalink] 28 Jul 2017, 01:49

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