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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question

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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 21 Aug 2012, 21:51
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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.

(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.



Project SC Butler: Day 16: Sentence Correction (SC2)


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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 23 Nov 2018, 22:07
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adkikani wrote:
Arro44 AdityaHongunti generis VeritasKarishma AjiteshArun aragonn

In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
Quote:
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

Can you help me understand if this is a noun+noun modifer or a simple noun phrase
with nouns assessment and problems with faced as verb-ed mofidier modifying noun - problems:

In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers

I am familiar with verb-ed and verb-ing modifying nouns, but can a noun phrase on its own
modify a noun - question on its own?

adkikani , I think you are asking about the introductory phrase in (D).

That introduction is a prepositional phrase that begins with "in."

Prepositional phrases are versatile.
Further, introductory phrases often "set the stage" or give context for the main clause.

An introductory prepositional phrase is not subject to rules that govern some other kinds of introductory phrases,
with one exception (preposition + __ING) addressed below.

Specifically, prepositional phrases at the beginning of a sentence
do not have to modify the subject that follows,
though they usually must refer to the main clause in some way.

----------------------

By contrast, 5 other types of introductory phrases must modify

(1) the subject in the clause that follows immediately

OR

(2) the subject in the immediately following clause OR the whole subsequent clause

•• 3 types of introductory phrases must modify the subject of the clause that follows the introductory phrase

• phrases that start with an adjective
Wet and slippery, the frog escaped from the little boy's grasp.

• phrases that start with a past participle (verbED)
Frightened by the wind, the child hid under the bed

• phrases that begin with a noun + modifiers
A veteran of the war in Afghanistan, the American soldier could not bear to be idle while civilians in Syria were gassed and massacred, so he joined the Kurdish YPG forces.

•• 2 types of intro phrases must modify either the subject of the subsequent clause
OR the whole clause:

• phrases that begin with present participles (___ING or verbING)
Weeping with relief, the refugee handed his child to the rescue workers.

• phrases that begin with a preposition and a participle, such as in assessing
In refusing to be cowed, the American press has played a pivotal, perhaps decisive, role in defending democracy.

--------------------

Unlike those five introductory phrases just listed,
introductory phrases that begin with a preposition
do not have to modify the subject that follows or the immediately following clause.

Prepositional introductory phrases can simply set the stage for the main clause.

On the GMAT, introductory prepositional phrases often modify a whole clause.

This introductory phrase is an adverbial modifier.
In context X, the question of ABC is irrelevant [to X].

Introductory phrases MAY set up a sort of causal link, as Arro44 wrote:
If you want to assess A's problem, don't compare A's wealth to B's wealth.
Slight rewrite:
While [or in the context of] performing an assessment of A's problems,
whether A is marginally better off than B is irrelevant [to that process of assessment].


• The introductory prepositional phrase acts as an adverbial modifier.
In what way, in what context, HOW is the entire question of whether A is marginally better off than B irrelevant?
The question is irrelevant when or while performing an assessment of problems faced by rural migrant workers.

I do not think that the phrase is an adjectivial modifier of "question." The phrase is an adverbial modifier of the whole main clause.

Hope that helps.
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 23 Nov 2018, 03:03
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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

Meaning : In an assesment (evaluation) of a certain situation, considering a scenario is irrelevant.

Quote:
(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

- Here "in assessing "needs a doer because "in assessing " is a modifier modifying some noun. The "question " does not assess the problem .

Quote:
(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.

- Same error as A.
Quote:
(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

- Same error as A . Also "they " is ambiguous
Quote:
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

- "an assessment " is correct. This clearly states that "in an assessment , considering bla bla bla is useless" . Here assessment itself is a noun and hence does not need a doer
Quote:
(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.

- Wordy and awkward . "they " in the end unnecessarily makes the sentence wordy. Also "they "does not have a clear antecedent
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New post 21 Aug 2012, 22:16
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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.--Verbing +doer - is the normal construcstion -> so Who? -> not surely the question
(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.- pronoun err
(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.
- Awkward construction, pronoun err, meaning changed

(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
- contender
(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.
- pronoun err


So D
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New post 23 Aug 2012, 16:35
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why can't it be C. I don't see any pronoun error
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New post 24 Aug 2012, 08:51
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lotus wrote:
why can't it be C. I don't see any pronoun error


Hi there,
Choice C - A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

This choice is incorrect because of its wordiness and awkwardness. There is no grammatical issue in this sentence as such. However, it is not very direct. Compare this portion in choice C - problems that rural migrant workers face – with this one in the correct choice D - problems faced by rural migrant workers. Undoubtedly, the latter is more precise and clear than the former.

The stylistic issue in Choice C makes it incorrect.
Hope this helps.
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 25 Aug 2012, 09:19
egmat wrote:
lotus wrote:
why can't it be C. I don't see any pronoun error


Hi there,
Choice C - A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

This choice is incorrect because of its wordiness and awkwardness. There is no grammatical issue in this sentence as such. However, it is not very direct. Compare this portion in choice C - problems that rural migrant workers face – with this one in the correct choice D - problems faced by rural migrant workers. Undoubtedly, the latter is more precise and clear than the former.

The stylistic issue in Choice C makes it incorrect.
Hope this helps.
Shraddha


I am very confused on A. Please guide why A is not correct.
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 27 Aug 2012, 00:52
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ranjeet75 wrote:
egmat wrote:
lotus wrote:
why can't it be C. I don't see any pronoun error


Hi there,
Choice C - A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

This choice is incorrect because of its wordiness and awkwardness. There is no grammatical issue in this sentence as such. However, it is not very direct. Compare this portion in choice C - problems that rural migrant workers face – with this one in the correct choice D - problems faced by rural migrant workers. Undoubtedly, the latter is more precise and clear than the former.

The stylistic issue in Choice C makes it incorrect.
Hope this helps.
Shraddha


I am very confused on A. Please guide why A is not correct.


A : Case of dangling modifier : In ASSESSING the problems.....................

Deciding to retake the GMAT , the problematic questions were posted in the forum = WHO is deciding, where's the subject without which the reader stays baffled ( Is it the questions decided to retake GMAT ); thus in A , the connection of In assessing the .................... with........... The question = Illogical/Sloppy.

To clear the maze : Deciding to retake GMAT, SKM posted the problematic questions in the forum.

Thus A is incorrect
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New post 27 Aug 2012, 07:21
ranjeet75 wrote:
I am very confused on A. Please guide why A is not correct.


Hi there,

We cover in detail all about the verb-ing modifiers and their functions depending upon their placement in our concept named "Modifiers - Verb-ing". Just log on to e-gmat.com and register for free. This concept features in the Preview Level 1 concepts. All the concepts in this section is free. Just try it. :)

Hoe this helps.
Thanks.
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New post 27 Aug 2012, 07:39
SC is my weakest verbal element so please please please critique my answer / logic:

The problem in the original question is the use of 'they'. Who is the author referring to? I think the sentence reads that the problems are better off than the urban workers since 'faced by rural migrant workers' is a modifier of problems, making problems the subject.

I think C changes the focus of the statement. The original is looking at the welfare of 2 groups of people, C looks at a question and discusses it's irrelevance.
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New post 27 Aug 2012, 08:06
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Hi @bradfris,

In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

Well, I’m afraid your assessment of this problem is not quite correct. Notice that “In assessing… workers” is a long modifier. Hence any part of this modifier cannot be the subject of the sentence.

Now the opening verb-ing modifier “assessing” denotes an action that needs a doer. Generally, the subject of the modified clause is the doer of the action denoted by the verb-ing modifier. In this case, the subject of the modified clause is “the question”. Now, can “the question” do the job of “assessing”? No, it cannot. Hence this modification is incorrect. This incorrect modification makes the original choice incorrect.

I don’t think there is any ambiguity in the reference of pronoun “they”. The context of the sentence clearly suggests that the logical antecedent of this pronoun is “rural migrant workers”.
We cover in detail all about the usage verb-ing modifier and pronoun reference in our e-learning course. Hit the “free trial” button below to start learning some of the important concepts tested on GMAT for free.

Hope this helps.
Thanks.
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New post 14 Apr 2013, 02:13
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IMO, D is correct.

In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
>>> Wrong. the question can access.

(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.
>>> Wrong. Worker is singular,

(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.
>>> Wrong. Very bad structure and awkward.

(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
>>> Correct.

(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face
>>> Wrong. Worker is singular

Hope it helps.
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 22 Nov 2018, 11:44
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I would go for answer choice D.

Answer choices B and E are confusing as the "they" could refer to either the rural migrant workers, the urban poor or both.

Choice C is quite wordy and sounds awkward.

Furthermore, the first modifier in choice A does not have a subject, thus the answer choice is wrong.

Choice D is the only clear sentence which preserves both grammar and meaning;

The sentence aims to inform the reader about the irrelevance of the comparison between the material wealth of the rural migrant workers and the wealth of the working poor.

You can pretty much boil it down to:

If you want to asses A´s problem, don't compare A´s wealth to B´s wealth.
I hope this helps.

Best regards,
Chris
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New post 23 Nov 2018, 13:49
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generis wrote:
[textarea]

Project SC Butler: Day 16: Sentence Correction (SC2)



In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.
(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.
(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.

OFFICIAL EXPLANATION
• Choice A presents a dangling modifier because nothing mentioned in the sentence
can perform the action of assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers.
Choice A states illogically that the question is assessing these problems.

• In B, the plural pronoun they cannot refer as intended [by the author of this question] to the singular rural migrant worker.

• C is awkward ( :thumbdown: ) and ambiguous: again, the question is not assessing the problems,
and irrelevant in assessing could be taken to mean either that the act of assessing the problems is irrelevant OR
that the question described is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems.

• Choice D is best

• As is the case in B, the lack of agreement between worker and they makes E wrong.

---------------

This OE is good, except for the use of "awkward" to describe (C).
The author is correct. (C) IS awkward.
Why?

The author does an excellent job at explaining why (C) is confusing and ambiguous.

Arro44 rewrote the meaning of the sentence in her or his own words. Bravo!
If you want to assess A´s problem, don't compare A´s wealth to B´s wealth.

AdityaHongunti is spot on about why GMAC often prefers the noun form of an ING word if there IS a noun form.
- "an assessment " is correct. This clearly states that "in an assessment , considering bla bla bla is useless" . Here assessment itself is a noun and hence does not need a doer

PRONOUN ambiguity - Read carefully.
"They" is not ambiguous.
It's clear from the logic of the sentence that "they" refers to rural migrant workers.
Why would a sentence compare problems to the urban working poor
in the context of assessing problems OF or FACED BY rural migrant workers?
Or, if we were to move forward for an antecedent, why compare working poor to working poor?
GMAC tolerates a lot more pronoun ambiguity than many people realize.
If it is clear from the structure / logic / cue words in the sentence which noun SHOULD be the antecedent,
GMAC allows that noun to stand for the pronoun.

Noun/pronoun disagreement.
B and E use the singular "worker."
When answer choices are long, look for single words that differ:
-- worker vs. workers
-- assessing vs. assessment

Answers by forum members
Although neither answer is entirely correct in analysis,
both posters chose the correct answer, and both had a couple of standout details.
I am encouraged when I see people "dare" to post.

It's a tie.

Kudos to both!

If I could award two kudos to each of you, I would. Why?
Your efforts will help others learn.
And you were brave. I respect that quality. :thumbup:
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 23 Nov 2018, 18:36
Arro44 AdityaHongunti generis VeritasKarishma AjiteshArun aragonn

In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

Quote:
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.


Can you help me understand if this is a noun+noun modifer or a simple noun phrase
with nouns assessment and problems with faced as verb-ed mofidier modifying noun - problems:

In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers

I am familiar with verb-ed and verb-ing modifying nouns, but can a noun phrase on its own
modify a noun - question on its own?
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 23 Nov 2018, 22:32
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adkikani wrote:
Arro44 AdityaHongunti generis VeritasKarishma AjiteshArun aragonn

In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

Quote:
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.


Can you help me understand if this is a noun+noun modifer or a simple noun phrase
with nouns assessment and problems with faced as verb-ed mofidier modifying noun - problems:

In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers

I am familiar with verb-ed and verb-ing modifying nouns, but can a noun phrase on its own
modify a noun - question on its own?


"In an assessment ..." is a prepositional phrase modifying "the question".
In A, B is irrelevant.

We prefer the noun form because if we use "in assessing .." we need the doer of the action as the subject.
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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question  [#permalink]

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New post 12 Jun 2019, 10:30
generis wrote:

Project SC Butler: Day 16: Sentence Correction (SC2)


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In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.

(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.


NOTE: For this question, BEST or EXCELLENT answers must include the meaning of this sentence.


The best or excellent answers get kudos, which will be awarded after the answer is revealed.


Can someone explain how is Option A incorrect?
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New post 05 Jul 2019, 10:54
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dreamer954 wrote:
generis wrote:

Project SC Butler: Day 16: Sentence Correction (SC2)


For SC butler Questions Click Here



In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(A) In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(B) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in assessing the problems that they face.

(C) A question that is irrelevant in assessing the problems that rural migrant workers face is whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor.

(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

(E) The question of whether the rural migrant worker is better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant in an assessment of the problems that they face.



Can someone explain how is Option A incorrect?

Hi dreamer954 , read the first post after the question (or the OE).

In assessing = in VerbING (essentially, a participial modifier)
Participial intros must modify either the subject of the subsequent clause or the whole clause, but if they modify the latter the sentence must still made sense.

A question cannot be in the process of assessing anything.

The subject of the subsequent clause is the question [of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor]. The whole phrase is the subject.

In assessing describes an action that a person would undertake.
(Or perhaps an action that a computer would do. :x
AI kinda gives me the creeps. )

Hope that helps.
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New post 17 Nov 2019, 07:35
GMATNinja according to the rile that you have told- subject2 will refer back to subject 1, D should be wrong- C should be correct answer because it might be awkward but at least grammatically correct. Can you please throw more light on the sub2->sub1 rule?

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New post 23 Nov 2019, 11:03
arshi016 wrote:
GMATNinja according to the rile that you have told- subject2 will refer back to subject 1, D should be wrong- C should be correct answer because it might be awkward but at least grammatically correct. Can you please throw more light on the sub2->sub1 rule?

Best
-Arshi.

I think you're thinking of the case when you have two subject-verb pairs in two clauses. Something like this:

    "Cucumbers cost less than tomatoes at grocery stores in Western states, but they also taste like poo." - Here, the subject of the second clause ("they") refers unambiguously to the subject of the first independent clause ("cucumbers"), so this is fine.

This is not what's going on in choice (D):

Quote:
(D) In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers, the question of whether they are better off materially than the urban working poor is irrelevant.

"In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers" does NOT have a subject-verb pair -- "faced" is not a verb here. Instead, it modifies "problems". Put another way: that first part of the sentence ("In an assessment of the problems faced by rural migrant workers") is just a modifier, and NOT a clause.

Sure, (D) technically has two possible antecedents for the pronoun "they" ("problems" and "workers"), but, as discussed in this video, pronoun ambiguity isn't necessarily a good reason to automatically disqualify an answer choice.

I hope that helps!
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Re: In assessing the problems faced by rural migrant workers the question   [#permalink] 23 Nov 2019, 11:03
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