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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
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ankushbagwale wrote:
Bunuel can you please how the number 21 is derived in the original explanation?

Also, here we know that the average is 10.5 & not 10 so how are we deducing that half the times sum will be less than 10 ( & not 10.5 ) & half the time ( sum will be more than 10.5) .

I can understand since number showing up on the dice being integers we will never get 10.5 ( it will be either 10 or 11 but never 10.5). Nonetheless, technically speaking do we need to say that half the times sum will be greater than average & half the time it will be lesser.


The probability of scoring 1 + 1 + 1 = 3 is the same as the probability of scoring 6 + 6 + 6 = 18 = 21 - 3.
The probability of scoring 2 + 1 + 1 = 4 is the same as the probability of scoring 6 + 6 + 5 = 17 = 21 - 4.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
Great question :) Could you please tell the source ??
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
High quality question. Hands off to the author!
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
Bunuel wrote:
Official Solution:

Mary and Joe are to throw three dice each. The score is the sum of points on all three dice. If Mary scores 10 in her attempt what is the probability that Joe will outscore Mary in his?

A. \(\frac{24}{64}\)
B. \(\frac{32}{64}\)
C. \(\frac{36}{64}\)
D. \(\frac{40}{64}\)
E. \(\frac{42}{64}\)


To outscore Mary, Joe has to score in the range of 11-18. The probability to score 3 is the same as the probability to score 18 (1-1-1 combination against 6-6-6, if 1-1-1 is on the tops of the dice the 6-6-6 is on the bottoms). By the same logic, the probability to score \(x\) is the same as the probability to score \(21 - x\). Therefore, the probability to score in the range 11-18 equals the probability to score in the range of 3-10. As 3-18 covers all possible outcomes the probability to score in the range 11-18 is \(\frac{1}{2}\) or \(\frac{32}{64}\).

Alternative Explanation

Expected value of one die is \(\frac{1}{6}*(1+2+3+4+5+6)=3.5\).

Expected value of three dice is \(3*3.5=10.5\).

Mary scored 10 so the probability to get the sum more than 10 (11, 12, 13, ..., 18), or more than the average, is the same as to get the sum less than average (10, 9, 8, ..., 3) = 1/2 = 32/64.

That's because the probability distribution is symmetrical for this case:

The probability of getting the sum of 3 (min possible sum) = the probability of getting the sum of 18 (max possible sum);

The probability of getting the sum of 4 = the probability of getting the sum of 17;

The probability of getting the sum of 5 = the probability of getting the sum of 16;

...

The probability of getting the sum of 10 = the probability of getting the sum of 11;

Thus the probability of getting the sum from 3 to 10 = the probability of getting the sum from 11 to 18 = 1/2.


Answer: B


Is there any other approach to this question? VeritasKarishma IanStewart egmat
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
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SDW2 wrote:
Is there any other approach to this question? VeritasKarishma IanStewart egmat


The fastest way to solve (and I'm really just saying what Bunuel said, but in different words) is to notice:

• when we roll one die, we're just as likely to get an above-average roll as a below-average one. That's what the earlier posts mean when they say dice outcomes are "symmetric". The same is true when we roll three dice.

• when we roll one die, the average roll is 3.5 (it's the average of the equally spaced list 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, so it is the median of that list). So when we roll three dice, the average roll is (3)(3.5) = 10.5. Since we can't get exactly 10.5, since that's not an integer, and since we're as likely to get an above average sum as a below average one, we must get a sum greater than 10.5 exactly half the time, and a sum less than 10.5 the other half of the time. So we get 11 or greater 1/2 the time.

There's an obvious alternative approach, but it takes a long time: you can just list all of the ways to get a sum of 18 (we must get 6-6-6), and a sum of 17 (we can get 5-6-6, 6-5-6 or 6-6-5), and so on. Using certain counting shortcuts makes that perhaps practical to do in two minutes, but it's long, and it's too tedious to be the only available method in a real GMAT question. There are other ways one could solve that are similar -- e.g. you could divide the problem into cases where you imagine getting a '6' on the first die, then a '5' on the first die, and so on, but they aren't any faster. I don't see an alternative solution to the first one I suggest above that is at all fast.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
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I have edited the question and the solution by adding more details to enhance its clarity. I hope it is now easier to understand.
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Re: M08-21 [#permalink]
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