Hi Guys, Rotman has just started accepting applications for August 2020. Starting this group so that we all can discuss about the application process and help each other out. Best of luck everyone! Add Rotman to your profile | Rotman Decision Tracker | Application Deadlines Link to Rotman Application Tracker : rotman-toronto-218/app-tracker.html Please click on the following link to join the WhatsApp group. https://chat.whatsapp.com/BZeKWbCjrm5FvxUVC75wjc

This is just my personal opinion. I'm probably biased because I'm a proud Rotman grad. Also, I'm from Toronto, so I might not have the international brand perceptions about either School. The Rotman brand on your resume carries more weight than Schulich, but I don't think that much more. Where to do your MBA is one of the toughest decisions you'll make in your life, as you only get to do it once (usually); some argue it's a harder decision than who to marry! You can divorce your wife, but not your MBA (usually). If you're a superstar candidate, it doesn't really matter where you go, you'll be pursued by everyone, no matter which school you're at. However, if you're a career switcher without a personal brand in the industry already, or new to Canada, I think Rotman has a leg up. A couple things: Rotman is tied to the University of Toronto. This has a lot of weight compared to York. After all, if you can hold a fork, you can to go to York... Being positioned downtown affords you a lot more networking opportunities that you cannot get from uptown. I've had several last-minute coffee chats with big names at big companies because they had last-minute cancellations where they're like "if you can get here in 15 minutes, I got 20 minutes to sit with you." From Rotman I can get there, no chance I can do the same from Schulich. Not just external networking, but internal too; Rotman has a bigger class and a much bigger alumni base . More companies do on-campus recruitment at Rotman than at Schulich, if you don't already have a job lined up post-MBA and need all the on-campus recruitment you can get, this is a big one. This is just statistics, but average post-MBA salary at Rotman is $99k, while at Schulich it's $88k; this means you'll make up the gap in three years , and if the statistic continues, the gap will continue to widen as your career progresses. On the other hand: $30k is a big gap if you can't fund that and have to pay out of pocket; some might not be able to make it work. Salary statistics may or may not apply to you, it really depends on the individual. Schulich has better employment rate statistics than Rotman does; at three months post-graduation, Schulich has 90% employed while Rotman has 85%. Schulich has a much, much better brand than York University; if people think or if you sell yourself as an MBA from Schulich and not an MBA from York, I feel that the perception changes. TD Bank CEO is a Schulich grad; Rotman does not have a grad in any of the Big 5 Banks (three other from Harvard, the last one from Ivey, last I checked). Again, it's real tough decision to make, but for me it was a super easy one. I was raised in Toronto, but I was also a career switcher from science with zero work experience , and I only applied to the Rotman School. While I considered Schulich briefly, mostly because of the money, nothing about Schulich really stood out to me. I ultimately didn't think the tuition savings was worth it and didn't even start an application. And congratulations on upping the scholarship! Was this an increased entrance scholarship, or was it a different scholarship altogether?

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Calling all Rotman(Toronto) MBA Applicants(2020 Intake) Class of 2022

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ghui

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02 Apr 2020, 03:27

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ghui

I intend to ask for more scholarship. Can you share some useful experiences/tips that help?

ghui

Have you checked out some of the previous topics on negotiating scholarships? If not, I advise you to go through some of the following topics.

https://gmatclub.com/forum/negotiate-sc ... l#p2275157
https://gmatclub.com/forum/negotiate-sc ... l#p1521760
https://gmatclub.com/forum/search.php?k ... mit=Search

Thank you. I am researching :D

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03 Apr 2020, 06:32

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08 Apr 2020, 18:25

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jigglypuff

Indeed, I had a scholarship offer in the acceptance letter and successfully earned another scholarship after asking for more from Rotman.
Currently, I am quite struggling to decide between Rotman and Schulich because both of them offered me scholarships but the tuition fee difference is about $30,000 which is huge to me.
I understand that in terms of Finance major, Rotman is stronger but I wonder whether it is worthy to invest more to attend Rotman.
I am a career changer and an international student.

Please help me with more insights, everyone.

Thank you.

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09 Apr 2020, 08:49

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jigglypuff

A couple people have asked me privately about negotiating the entrance scholarship. My answer has been the same: you can try, once and very politely, but I've personally not seen this happening at Rotman.

So please let us know if anyone is successful in doing so!
For what it is worth-- I have not seen Rotman come back too often and up their awards with my clients-- but in this covid world -- I would never say never. A lot of it depends on WHO YOU ARE-- it is not one size fits all. If you bring something really valuable to Rotman, you have more leverage. But I do agree with being exceedingly polite-- and not treating this like you are shopping for a used car trying to get the best deal. I've had my clients at Rotman do really well on the job market post MBA. Good luck to you!
Also, entrance scholarships aren't the only scholarships available. There are good in-program awards, scholar awards, OGS, etc.

The loan also has pretty good terms so...

jigglypuff

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11 Apr 2020, 05:07

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ghui

jigglypuff

This is just my personal opinion. I'm probably biased because I'm a proud Rotman grad. Also, I'm from Toronto, so I might not have the international brand perceptions about either School.

The Rotman brand on your resume carries more weight than Schulich, but I don't think that much more. Where to do your MBA is one of the toughest decisions you'll make in your life, as you only get to do it once (usually); some argue it's a harder decision than who to marry! You can divorce your wife, but not your MBA (usually).

If you're a superstar candidate, it doesn't really matter where you go, you'll be pursued by everyone, no matter which school you're at.

However, if you're a career switcher without a personal brand in the industry already, or new to Canada, I think Rotman has a leg up. A couple things:

Rotman is tied to the University of Toronto. This has a lot of weight compared to York. After all, if you can hold a fork, you can to go to York...
Being positioned downtown affords you a lot more networking opportunities that you cannot get from uptown. I've had several last-minute coffee chats with big names at big companies because they had last-minute cancellations where they're like "if you can get here in 15 minutes, I got 20 minutes to sit with you." From Rotman I can get there, no chance I can do the same from Schulich.
Not just external networking, but internal too; Rotman has a bigger class and a much bigger alumni base.
More companies do on-campus recruitment at Rotman than at Schulich, if you don't already have a job lined up post-MBA and need all the on-campus recruitment you can get, this is a big one.
This is just statistics, but average post-MBA salary at Rotman is $99k, while at Schulich it's $88k; this means you'll make up the gap in three years, and if the statistic continues, the gap will continue to widen as your career progresses.

On the other hand:

$30k is a big gap if you can't fund that and have to pay out of pocket; some might not be able to make it work.
Salary statistics may or may not apply to you, it really depends on the individual.
Schulich has better employment rate statistics than Rotman does; at three months post-graduation, Schulich has 90% employed while Rotman has 85%.
Schulich has a much, much better brand than York University; if people think or if you sell yourself as an MBA from Schulich and not an MBA from York, I feel that the perception changes.
TD Bank CEO is a Schulich grad; Rotman does not have a grad in any of the Big 5 Banks (three other from Harvard, the last one from Ivey, last I checked).

Again, it's real tough decision to make, but for me it was a super easy one. I was raised in Toronto, but I was also a career switcher from science with zero work experience, and I only applied to the Rotman School. While I considered Schulich briefly, mostly because of the money, nothing about Schulich really stood out to me. I ultimately didn't think the tuition savings was worth it and didn't even start an application.

And congratulations on upping the scholarship! Was this an increased entrance scholarship, or was it a different scholarship altogether?

ghui

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11 Apr 2020, 17:43

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ghui

jigglypuff

Rotman is tied to the University of Toronto. This has a lot of weight compared to York. After all, if you can hold a fork, you can to go to York...
Being positioned downtown affords you a lot more networking opportunities that you cannot get from uptown. I've had several last-minute coffee chats with big names at big companies because they had last-minute cancellations where they're like "if you can get here in 15 minutes, I got 20 minutes to sit with you." From Rotman I can get there, no chance I can do the same from Schulich.
Not just external networking, but internal too; Rotman has a bigger class and a much bigger alumni base.
More companies do on-campus recruitment at Rotman than at Schulich, if you don't already have a job lined up post-MBA and need all the on-campus recruitment you can get, this is a big one.
This is just statistics, but average post-MBA salary at Rotman is $99k, while at Schulich it's $88k; this means you'll make up the gap in three years, and if the statistic continues, the gap will continue to widen as your career progresses.

On the other hand:

$30k is a big gap if you can't fund that and have to pay out of pocket; some might not be able to make it work.
Salary statistics may or may not apply to you, it really depends on the individual.
Schulich has better employment rate statistics than Rotman does; at three months post-graduation, Schulich has 90% employed while Rotman has 85%.
Schulich has a much, much better brand than York University; if people think or if you sell yourself as an MBA from Schulich and not an MBA from York, I feel that the perception changes.
TD Bank CEO is a Schulich grad; Rotman does not have a grad in any of the Big 5 Banks (three other from Harvard, the last one from Ivey, last I checked).

Thank you so much.
I decided to join Rotman yesterday, after 10 days of consideration and tons of advices from friends and alumni

Anyway, your insights are super useful to me and I believe they help others who are deciding.

About extra scholarship, they increased my entrance scholarship, as I read in scholarship announcement letter. So the asking worked ^^

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12 Apr 2020, 07:38

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Congratulations on making a decision! Personally, I think it's the wiser choice.

ghui

About extra scholarship, they increased my entrance scholarship, as I read in scholarship announcement letter. So the asking worked ^^

If I may ask, how did you go about asking? What arguments did you provide? You're the first I've heard of that they actually upped the entrance scholarship for. I've heard others where they offered other scholarships, but upping the entrance scholarship is a first that I've personally heard.

ghui

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12 Apr 2020, 20:53

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jigglypuff

Congratulations on making a decision! Personally, I think it's the wiser choice.

ghui

About extra scholarship, they increased my entrance scholarship, as I read in scholarship announcement letter. So the asking worked ^^

Indeed, they mentioned that I received another Entrance Award. The first one was also Entrance Award so I thought that they increased it. Maybe they offered me another one.

When asking for more scholarship, I emailed to both my interviewer and the director of admission board.

I think the proper approach is:
+ show gratitude about their offer
+ state your status which requires more aids
+ prove that you're a potential student who has unique things to contribute to the school
+ show the other school's offer, in the most polite way

+ again, show the desire to attend Rotman

That was how I did. Hope it help.

About my profile:
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+ WE: 10 years. Running 2 businesses as an entrepreneur.

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13 Apr 2020, 01:25

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Hi ghui

Thanks for the detailed debrief.

On the point of sharing the other school's offer did you upfront mentioned the amount offered or the other schools name?

Also did you negotiate once or did you re-negotiate after they sent you the additional entrance scholarship.
If you did re-negotiate how did you go about it?

Thanks again for your inputs

ghui

jigglypuff

Congratulations on making a decision! Personally, I think it's the wiser choice.

ghui

About extra scholarship, they increased my entrance scholarship, as I read in scholarship announcement letter. So the asking worked ^^

+ again, show the desire to attend Rotman

That was how I did. Hope it help.

About my profile:
+ Vietnamese
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+ GMAT: 700
+ WE: 10 years. Running 2 businesses as an entrepreneur.

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13 Apr 2020, 04:34

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I think your methodology here is badass. I'm stealing this! Enjoy Toronto! ghui

ghui

jigglypuff

Congratulations on making a decision! Personally, I think it's the wiser choice.

ghui

About extra scholarship, they increased my entrance scholarship, as I read in scholarship announcement letter. So the asking worked ^^

+ again, show the desire to attend Rotman

That was how I did. Hope it help.

About my profile:
+ Vietnamese
+ GPA: 3.6
+ GMAT: 700
+ WE: 10 years. Running 2 businesses as an entrepreneur.

Posted from my mobile device

ghui

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13 Apr 2020, 04:49

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bschoolhunter

I did mentioned other school's offer and attach its offer letter in the email. Make sure that the other school is at the same level as the school you want to ask, in my case Schulich vs Rotman.

I didn't re-negotiate after receiving additional offer because I was highly aware that having extra scholarship from Rotman is rare and I appreciated it. Furthermore, I thought that re-negotiation wouldn't work because I had nothing new to give them and might hurt my image.

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13 Apr 2020, 05:11

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Thanks a lot for this insightful debrief.

ghui

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13 Apr 2020, 09:23

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ghui

Indeed, they mentioned that I received another Entrance Award. The first one was also Entrance Award so I thought that they increased it. Maybe they offered me another one.

There are several entrance scholarships, so it might've been a different one altogether. Either way, the end result for you is the same, haha.

ghui

About my profile:
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+ WE: 10 years. Running 2 businesses as an entrepreneur.

I think this is a big reason why (plus the Schulich offer). I would argue this puts you firmly in the star candidate category.

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14 Apr 2020, 19:44

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Hi everyone,

I need some inputs. I was initially offered an admit for Rotman MBA without a scholarship. I later applied to both Ivey and Queens and each has offered me $40,000. I went back to Rotman with these competing offers and now they have awarded me $15000. The difference in the tuition is a lot. Ivey is effectively $78k and Rotman is at $105k. Living of course Toronto is more, but I wanted to know otherwise, are they both at power or is Rotman better? I am not actively considering queens but between the three which one is the best offer to accept?

Thanks!

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15 Apr 2020, 06:27

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I would argue that your decision is between Rotman and Ivey, but personally I think that your criteria shouldn't be primarily finances. They're both great schools, arguably interchangeable as the Top 2 in Canada, but Rotman is a two-year program and Ivey is a one-year program, and there are huge implications for this.

Are you a career switcher? Do you need that internship between first and second year? If yes, then you should go to Rotman.

Are you getting an MBA to up your profile and already have a job lined up post-MBA? If yes, then you should go to Ivey.

I believe the money isn't something that you should make your decision on, unless you're paying out of pocket up-front and you don't have enough. If you've got the cash on hand, or if you're taking out a loan to repay later, it's all really a wash in the end.

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15 Apr 2020, 08:24

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eishmehta

Totally agree.

One more thing, if you're international student and intend to work in Canada after graduation, Rotman 2-year program allows for 3 years work permit, while 1-year program of Ivey only allows for 1 year work-permit.

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15 Apr 2020, 08:49

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I too believe that finance should not be the sole criteria.
Based on my research I have jotted down the key points:-

1. Are you looking for a Total career change or looking for a minor change

2. Do you shine in larger cohorts with more competition or shine in smaller intimate cohorts

3. Are you looking for a career in IB/ VC or a career in consulting.

4. As Ivey generally has a cohort with higher work exp. companies looking to recruit such candidates come. Hence you might want to evaluate basis your work exp.

Lastly I feel visa duration in Canada should not be a consideration as all Visa's generally get extended.

ghui

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To answer:
1. I am currently into audit and have a US CPA. I want to shift into financial consulting and then private equity. So there is a considerable shift. But since my background has been in accounting there is a knowledge gap for core finance backgrounds which I want to acquire.

2. Well, smaller groups are a lot easier to shine in but I believe if you are good at something, be it a big or a small group, you will get noticed.

3. As I mentioned, my short term goals are aligned towards Financial Consulting/advisory- majorly for M&A deals.

4. Currently, I have 3.5 years of experience so, by the time Ivey starts it should be 4+ but the experience is in audit.

I agree that my decision should be driven by the career switch I seek and not just finances but someone who is an international student taking up a loan of almost $150K for Rotman ( 82 lakhs INR) vs 110K for Ivey( 60lakhs), I will consider finances as a major component in my decision.

bschoolhunter

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15 Apr 2020, 21:45

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Hey,

Thank you for your points. I agree that for the career switch I seek, Rotman is the safer bet. My post-MBA goals are aligned towards financial consulting and Private Equity. A first-year student told me that getting a summer internship has been quite difficult. Companies would come and hire only 2-3 people and till March mid she had no offer in hand and then COVID happened. Usually, by when do majority people have a confirmed internship? Also, are most of the internships acquired through recruitment on-campus/ job postings by Rotman or is personal networking a huge component?

jigglypuff

eishmehta

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15 Apr 2020, 23:24

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As I have known from Rotman and Schulich alumni, finding internship opportunities are mainly your responsibility. The school offers the strong alumni network, career center, and events, but you have to dive in to build your own network. Especially in finance sector, knowing someone who knows someone is a huge advantage.