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Bunuel
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Yes but we do know know how many snakes there are in the box.

For example if the number of snakes is 10 there could be 9 ; 1 or it could be 5;5.

Second one is clearly insufficient also

And both are insufficient.

99 Snakes 1 cobra 98 vipers, or 97/2

Please explain

Thank you
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Princas1
Yes but we do know know how many snakes there are in the box.

For example if the number of snakes is 10 there could be 9 ; 1 or it could be 5;5.

Second one is clearly insufficient also

And both are insufficient.

99 Snakes 1 cobra 98 vipers, or 97/2

Please explain

Thank you

Let me ask you if there are 5 vipers and 5 cobras, would the second statement be correct?
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It took me sometime to understand statement 1 in the test. For those having trouble like me, hope this helps!
Statement 1: Any 2 snakes, possibilities ---> V, V or V, C or C, V.
There is no possibility for C, C. This means that there is only 1 cobra in the box. Sufficient.

Statement 2: Totally irrelevant and useless.
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Bunuel
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Yes but we do know know how many snakes there are in the box.

For example if the number of snakes is 10 there could be 9 ; 1 or it could be 5;5.

Second one is clearly insufficient also

And both are insufficient.

99 Snakes 1 cobra 98 vipers, or 97/2

Please explain

Thank you

Let me ask you if there are 5 vipers and 5 cobras, would the second statement be correct?

Hey Bunuel, it's still not clear for me concerning answer (1).

If we take your example with 10 snakes, doesn't it mean that we can have anything from (5V 5C; 6V 4C;...9V 1C) according to statement 1? A ratio of 6:4 V to C is still "at least 1 viper" for any 2 snakes.

Thanks for clarifying.
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Bunuel
Princas1
Yes but we do know know how many snakes there are in the box.

For example if the number of snakes is 10 there could be 9 ; 1 or it could be 5;5.

Second one is clearly insufficient also

And both are insufficient.

99 Snakes 1 cobra 98 vipers, or 97/2

Please explain

Thank you

Let me ask you if there are 5 vipers and 5 cobras, would the second statement be correct?

Hey Bunuel, it's still not clear for me concerning answer (1).

If we take your example with 10 snakes, doesn't it mean that we can have anything from (5V 5C; 6V 4C;...9V 1C) according to statement 1? A ratio of 6:4 V to C is still "at least 1 viper" for any 2 snakes.

Thanks for clarifying.

NO. We cannot have more than 1 cobras. If there are 5 cobras and 5 vipers then the first statement will NOT hold. (1) says from ANY two snakes from Pandora's box at least one is a viper. If there are 5 cobras and 5 vipers then we could have two snakes from which BOTH are vipers.
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At least one is a Viper --> Couldn't there be two vipers - and therefore 0 cobras - and invalidate statement 1? Thanks.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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Hi Bunnel,

Please help me understand the flaw in my logic, I understand that from the 1st question the number of snakes in the box can be ONLY 2, that's the only way to have 1 viper and 1 cobra, however, I fail to understand that why anybody hasn't considered any other snake than viper or cobra.

Example : If I have a viper, cobra and black mamba - Using statement 1 I pick 2 snakes and I draw a viper and black mamba, the 1st statement is satisfied, however, it does not help me get the number of cobras.

I have gone through the OG problems and in some problems the OE does mention content, which is not stated in the question. Could you please help ??
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Hi Bunnel,

Please help me understand the flaw in my logic, I understand that from the 1st question the number of snakes in the box can be ONLY 2, that's the only way to have 1 viper and 1 cobra, however, I fail to understand that why anybody hasn't considered any other snake than viper or cobra.

Example : If I have a viper, cobra and black mamba - Using statement 1 I pick 2 snakes and I draw a viper and black mamba, the 1st statement is satisfied, however, it does not help me get the number of cobras.

I have gone through the OG problems and in some problems the OE does mention content, which is not stated in the question. Could you please help ??

1. It's not necessary the box to have 1 viper and 1 cobra. The box can have 1 cobra and any number of vipers more than or equal to 1. The solution even gives an example: 1 cobra and 1 viper or 1 cobra and 99 vipers.

2. About some other types of snakes. This is also addressed in the thread. (1) says: From any two snakes from Pandora's box at least one is a viper. There cannot be any other type of snake in the box because we know that there is at least one viper and at least one cobra and if there is some other type snake there then we can choose cobra and that snake and the condition will be violated.
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At least one is a Viper --> Couldn't there be two vipers - and therefore 0 cobras - and invalidate statement 1? Thanks.

In DS questions, you are never trying to 'invalidate' the statements. The statements are facts - they can't be wrong. You're trying to work out whether the question "how many cobras are there?" can have only one answer, or more than one answer.

If, when looking at one statement, you're considering a scenario that would make that statement false, you're considering a scenario that doesn't agree with the information you've been provided, so you're considering a scenario that isn't relevant to the problem.
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Is this one of your questions, Bunuel? It's a really good question - it's logically tricky, but the setup is elegantly simple, like in many real high-level GMAT problems.

In case it helps anyone, when I read Statement 1, I rephrased it this way: "if you pick two snakes from the box, you will never pick two cobras". That means there can be at most one cobra in the box, and since there's at least one, there must be exactly one.
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IanStewart
Is this one of your questions, Bunuel? It's a really good question - it's logically tricky, but the setup is elegantly simple, like in many real high-level GMAT problems.

In case it helps anyone, when I read Statement 1, I rephrased it this way: "if you pick two snakes from the box, you will never pick two cobras". That means there can be at most one cobra in the box, and since there's at least one, there must be exactly one.

Yes, this is one of my questions. I knew that it would be a hard question when writing it but it turned out to be one of the hardest ones based on the timer stats and replies.

The same way a simple principle tested here: https://gmatclub.com/forum/m03-183621.html#p1413892 seems to be hard to grasp for many.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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I think this is a high-quality question and I agree with explanation.
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