Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places sh

Dear AbdurRakib,

I'm happy to respond.

First of all, notice that "at least thirty feet and more" is wildly redundant. We can say either "at least thirty feet" or "thirty feet and more," but we can't combine those two. Choice (A) & (E) are automatically out.

The most natural idiom here is "while some do X, others do Y." The natural contrast of "some" is "others." The constructions "some others" and "the others" are incorrect, so (A) & (B) are wrong.

Finally, notice that (D) & (E) change the meaning. The prompt contrasts most tides to another category with big tides, and this latter category includes the Bay of Fundy as an example. Both (D) & (E) make the mistake of comparing all other tides to just the Bay of Fundy specifically, as if that were the only spot on earth with gigantic tides. These are wrong.

The only possible answer is (C), the OA. This is a truly excellent question, as the official questions typically are.

Does this make sense?
Mike
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Hello Everyone!

Let's take a look at this question, one problem at a time, and come to the correct answer quickly. To get started, here is the original question, with major differences between each option highlighted in orange:

Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, some others, such as the Bay of Fundy, have tides of at least thirty feet and more.

A. some others, such as the Bay of Fundy, have tides of at least thirty feet and more
B. the others, such as the Bay of Fundy, that have tides of more than thirty feet
C. others, such as the Bay of Fundy, have tides of more than thirty feet
D. those at the Bay of Fundy, which has tides of more than thirty feet
E. the ones at the Bay of Fundy have tides of at least thirty feet and more

After a quick glance over each option, it's clear that we have to ways to tackle this question. Whichever method you choose, you'll knock out 2-3 options at once:

1. others / those / the ones
2. at least thirty feet and more vs. more than thirty feet

The easiest place to begin seems to be #2 on our list: at least thirty feet and more vs. more than thirty feet.

The GMAT prefers options that are concise and free of redundancies whenever possible. If we look closely, we can already see a problem with the phrase "at least thirty feet and more" - it's redundant! We could say "at least thirty feet" or "more than thirty feet," which both mean pretty close to the same thing, but to put them together is unnecessary! So let's eliminate options A & D because they are redundant.

(*Note: I do understand that the phrases "at least thirty feet" and "more than thirty feet" mean something slightly different mathematically. "At least thirty feet" means thirty feet and higher, while "more than thirty feet" means anything higher than, but not including, thirty feet. However, since the point of this phrase is to show that some tides are small, yet others are large, this difference isn't really the focus here. What the GMAT is looking for here is concise wording.)

Now that we've eliminated 2 options, let's tackle #1 on our list: referring to others / those / the ones. There are two ways of looking at this:

Option #1: Idiomatic Structure

The idiomatic structure this sentence uses is "some do X, while others do Y." It is not idiomatically correct to say "some do X, while the others do Y" or "some do X, while those do Y." Therefore, you can eliminate options B & D because they're not idiomatic.

Option #2: Correct Usage of the conjunction "but."

We use the coordinating conjunction "but" to combine two independent clauses. What comes before the "but" is already an independent clause (we know this because it's not underlined), so let's make sure the clause after "but" is independent for each option:

B. Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, the others, such as the Bay of Fundy, that have tides of more than thirty feet. --> This is INCORRECT because the clause after the conjunction cannot stand alone!

C. Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, others, such as the Bay of Fundy, have tides of more than thirty feet. --> This is CORRECT because the clause after the conjunction can stand alone!

D. Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, those at the Bay of Fundy, which has tides of more than thirty feet. --> This is INCORRECT because the clause after the conjunction cannot stand alone!

Therefore, you can eliminate options B & D because they also don't follow the rule of using an independent clause after a coordinating conjunction!

There you have it - option C is the correct answer!


Don't study for the GMAT. Train for it.
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Dear Friends,

Here is a detailed explanation to this question-

Concepts tested here: Pronouns + Grammatical Construction + Awkwardness/Redundancy

A: This answer choice uses the redundant phrases "some others" and "at least thirty feet and more", rendering it awkward and needlessly wordy.

B: This answer choice fails to form a complete sentence; as the verb "have" is part of a modifying phrase, there is no active verb to act upon the subject "the others".

C: Correct. This answer choice acts upon the subject "others" with the active verb "have" to form a complete thought, leading to a complete sentence. Further, in the sentence formed by Option C, the pronoun "others" clearly and logically refers to the noun "places".

D: This answer choice fails to form a complete sentence; as the verb "has" is part of a modifying phrase, there is no active verb to act upon the subject "the others". Further, Option D suffers from a pronoun error, as the pronoun "those" lacks a clear and logical referent.

E: This answer choice suffers from a pronoun error, as the pronoun "ones" lacks a clear and logical referent. Further, Option E uses the needlessly wordy phrase "at least thirty feet and more", leading to awkwardness and redundancy.

Hence, C is the best answer choice.

All the best!
Experts' Global Team
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In original sentence it says tides can be atleast 30 feet but Option C says more than 30 feet. Doesn't it change the meaning of the original sentence. ?

Posted from my mobile device

Hi somtsat99 ,

You missed a very small point in option A.

It says atleast 30 feet AND more. This means it has to be greater than 30. Hence, option C is clearly maintaining the original meaning.
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Dear somtsat99,

I'm happy to respond.

My friend, I think you are bringing mathematical logic to a SC question. Why this is problematic is very subtle.

You see, in math, we can talk about the precise number 30. If it's true that x = 30, then the statements x > 30 and x < 30 are both false. In the realm of mathematics, there's an infinity of difference between, say, 30 and 30 + (10^-50). Mathematics is realm of perfect precision.

Now, the thing that many students don't appreciate is that this side of math, the perfect precision, absolutely does not exist in the real world. It's funny: in math class and on the Quant section of the GMAT, you need to have this mindset of precision, but in many ways, that precision is a fiction that doesn't exist anywhere else.

Here, in this problem, we are talking about ocean tides. Whether the ocean is at high tide or low tide, there are always waves, sometimes small waves and sometimes large waves. I don't think it would make sense to talk about a tide that was exactly mathematically 30 ft. Among other things, a measurement of that magnitude would involve measurements down to the individual atom, and I can guarantee that the oceanographers who are studying these tides are not concerned with individual atoms. Similarly, 30 and 30 + (10^-50) are completely distinct mathematically, but no scientists on the planet could possibly measure a difference as small as (10^-50) feet--that's considerably smaller than most subatomic particles.

In the fictional realm of mathematical precision, there is a precise difference between "at least 30 ft," which means T >= 30, and "more than 30 feet," which means T > 30. Those two are completely different in the fictional realm of mathematical precision, but any distinction between those two is 100% meaningless in the real physical world of measurement. Thus, the change from one to the other would be a profound mathematical difference but absolutely no difference in the real world. Thus, it entails no difference in meaning in the world of GMAT SC, which reflects the real world, not the fictional world of mathematics.

Does all this make sense?
Mike
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Could the reason B & D are wrong be that both answer choices are fragments without a verb in the second part of the sentence?

but while some places show no tides at all,
B. the others, such as the Bay of Fundy, that have tides of more than thirty feet
D. those at the Bay of Fundy, which has tides of more than thirty feet

Hi lary301254M7, B and D do have a verb in the second part of the sentence (have and has respectively).

The issue with these options is the absence of a main verb (basically the verb of an Independent clause is called the main verb). The sentence needed an Independent clause, because of the presence of but in the original sentence.

But is a coordinating conjunction that connects two Independent clauses. While the first part of the sentence is an Independent clause (Tides typically range from three to six feet), the second part (after the but) does not have any Independent clause in options B and D.

p.s. Our book EducationAisle Sentence Correction Nirvana discusses Independent clauses, their application and examples in significant detail. If someone is interested, PM me your email-id; I can mail the corresponding section.
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A. at least 30 feet and more translated to >= 30 C. 30 more than 30 feet translates to >30 which changes the meaning of the sentence. can anyone please explain?

Hi Abhi, very technically speaking, an argument may be put forth that at least 30 feet or more translates to > = 30, while at least 30 feet and more translates to > 30.

Having said that, this kind of minor mathematical nitpicking might not be the best way to approach a sentence correction question.
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The question is included in past OGs for a long time for some reasons that most test takers ignore
This question has a very direct answer, but, it is essential to take "all the juice out of the cane"

The question is presenting a concept of "WORDINESS" and I suppose all the solutions presented have included the reason to by pass the question. Now let us look at another approach, an approach that is usually helpful in the higher difficulty questions

SO LET US BEGIN

Round 1 MISSING VERB
On GMAT every sentence is of the type S+V+O(can be indirect)
here
option B has no verb, just a modifier clause that if you read clearly leaves you wanting more
D has same issue

Round 2 HIDDEN PARALLELISM
Very tricky to be observed
While some people eat, the ones in my house have drinking problem
v
While some eat, the others in my house have a drinking problem.4

Do you see it??
While some....., the others

not "some others" as in option A
E is eliminated for this reason


C is the winner!!!!!!!
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is "at least" equivalent to "more than"?

I chose answer A because "at least" and "more than" are not the same thing; Is not changing from "at least" to "more than" changes the the intention of the message the author try to convey?

No, but at least and more is equivalent to more than.

However, it is very unlikely that GMAT would test you on these differences.
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of at least thirty feet and more is redundant and incorrect.

This answer choice becomes a sentence fragment. Let's look at the sentence without the non-essential modifier.

Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, the others, such as the Bay of Fundy, that have tides of more than thirty feet.

"the others that have tides of more than thirty feet"???

The "that" conjunction is not needed and is confusing.

Nothing wrong here. Let's remove the non-essential modifier.

Tides typically range from three to six feet, but while some places show no tides at all, others, such as the Bay of Fundy, have tides of more than thirty feet

Perfect.

Pronoun "those" refers to "tides" and we can substitute "the tides" for "those" to see if the pronoun makes sense.

"those" is fine, but "has" is incorrectly in singular form. Further, "which has" makes the same conjunction error as in (B)

"ones" refers to "tides." Fine. But now we have redundancy. If we substitute "tides" for "ones," we get a redundancy.

"the tides at the Bay of Funcy have tides of at least thirty feet and more.

Further, this answer choice makes the same mistake as (A). "of at least thirty feet and more" is inccorect.

Hi,
I picked option-A instead of C.
My logic:
C is grouping places in 2 types only: First without tides, other one with tide> 30 feet. Isn’t it the wrong meaning?
Option A with “some others” leaves scope of different length of waves possible. I understand “at least 30 feet and more” is redundant, but option C changes the meaning.
Any one, please help on this.
GMATNinja

There's a common misconception that it's wrong for an answer choice to "change the meaning." There's no original meaning you need to preserve. Instead, think of it this way: there are five sentences. You want the one that's clearest and most logical.

Take another look at (C):


This option is saying that some places have no tides at all, while others have tides that are more than 30 feet tall. That seems perfectly fine. Surfer A is sitting on a calm, placid sea, bummed that he can't catch a wave. Surfer B is catching massive waves, over 30 feet tall. Maybe they're 31 feet tall; maybe they're 46 feet tall. This seems perfectly logical and clear.

You noted correctly that, in (A), the phrase, "at least 30 feet and more," is redundant. Worse, it's confusing. If we know that "at least 30 feet" captures any value that's 30 or greater, "the more" seems like it might refer to something other than height. But nothing else is specified, so the reader is left scratching her head, trying to puzzle out the meaning. At least 30 feet and more... dangerous? At least 30 feet and more... full of sharks? Who knows?

So rather than worry about whether (C) changes the meaning, ask yourself whether (C) is clearer. Because it is, it's a better answer choice.

I hope that helps!
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option A here says that ''SOME OTHERS''

While Option C says ''OTHERS'', this should make meaning distortion
As option C is referring to all the others while the original sentence is only saying about some others.!!!!

Would appreciate anyone could comment here.

AVyas13397 others does not imply all the remaining tides. Also, there is no such thing as the original sentence. Option A is just another option. The only non-negotiable part of an SC question is the non-underlined portion. See GMATninja's post above for more on this.

we dont need to focus on "others" to find the OA. but lets think about this point.

"the others"
"the" means you already know the entity. if you dont know the entities, you cant use "the". some examples are

there are 3 girls. one of them is from Havard, the others is from Standford.

in this sentence, we already know "the others" , so, "the " is correct.

in our problem, "some" precedes and "others" follow. this context means, we can not know the entity after "others" and we can not use "the others".

choice D and E change the meaning. "those at bay" is mentioned as an example not as what is compared. but honestly, this meaning change is hard to realize in the test room. D and E suffer clear mistakes, incorrect structure and redundance " more", so, eliminate them on the basis of the clear mistake first