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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the siz

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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are
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TomB wrote:
Hai saarang

I know that " rock samples" is the subject of the sentence. I need some perfection in eliminating middlemen to find the subject and verb of a sentence. " the size" is between "about twice" and "of the 6-mile asteroid". how should I eliminate " the size".

The method i followed is "about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid " is a prepositional phrase. Is this correct.

The correct answer is E not C. "dated at" is the correct idiom

please explain


Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are

All part in red are wrong with respect to idioms and subject verb agreement. E is correct. Hope this helps..!!
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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are
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Last edited by Nevernevergiveup on 12 Nov 2016, 10:02, edited 1 time in total.
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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are ANSWER

The subject 'rock samples' is plural so both the verb after 'dinosaurs', 'have', and the verb before 'evidence', 'are', have to be plural.

The correct idiom is 'dated at.'

Hope that helps :).
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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6 mile wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is

(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus

(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are

(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus

(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are


[Reveal] Spoiler:
Normally experts say
estimated at should be followed by an noun
e.g: the temperature is estimated at negative five hundred degrees
and estimated to be should be followed by non nouns(such as adjectives)
e.g the fossil is estimated to be 500 years old
THEN WHY ARE WE CHOOSING E OVER C?
VERBAL EXPERTS?

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New post 05 Aug 2012, 13:18
Quote:
* "at" is a preposition.
* prepositions must be followed by nouns.
* "xxx number of years old" is not a noun.
so, wrong.

in the other example -- "temperatures estimated at xxxx degrees fahrenheit" -- there's no problem, because "xxxx degrees fahrenheit" is a noun.

i don't think anything else is happening here.
the OG explanations are wrong fairly regularly (though not in most cases); this is one of those times.


This is what Ron Purewal of Manhattan GMAT has to say about estimated at/to be scenario
Shouldn't the same logic apply to dated at/dated to be as well?
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New post 05 Aug 2012, 14:58
souvik101990 wrote:
Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6 mile wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth

A ) Same

B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus

C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are

D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus

E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are


Normally experts say
estimated at should be followed by an noun
e.g: the temperature is estimated at negative five hundred degrees
and estimated to be should be followed by non nouns(such as adjectives)
e.g the fossil is estimated to be 500 years old
THEN WHY ARE WE CHOOSING E OVER C?
VERBAL EXPERTS?


I chose E bcs have been + dated +to be wont do ..

Pls check the link -
http://www.manhattangmat.com/forums/dat ... -t604.html

here it gives C as option/answer !

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New post 06 Aug 2012, 02:43
souvik101990 wrote:
i know it gives E
I am asking why!!
Why the discrepancy between estimated to be and dated to be?


souvik, the link, discussion at MGMAT, conveys answer to be C!
your OG answer says E !

the discrepancy is in two answers ..
unless we know which one is correct - let have some expert comment,
then only it is relevant to discuss 'estimated to be/dated to be ..'

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New post 06 Aug 2012, 07:06
souvik101990 wrote:
yeah thats what i am trying
EXPERTS, EXPERTS WHERE ART THOU?



kramacha1979 wrote:
wrote:
Q1 ) Why E not C


the only difference between (c) and (e) is idiomatic expression.
you don't say "dated to be..."; you do say "dated at...".

like other idiomatic expressions, this is one of those things that doesn't go according to any sort of logical rule; you just have to know it.
you should dedicate a page or two of a notebook to this, or make some flash cards for the ones you don't know.


This is what Ron has to say about DATED AT & DATED TO BE.

The rule is applicable with other expression with other expressions like ESTIMATED or ESTIMATED TO BE.

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New post 06 Aug 2012, 07:09
jaiswalamrita wrote:
souvik101990 wrote:
yeah thats what i am trying
EXPERTS, EXPERTS WHERE ART THOU?



kramacha1979 wrote:
wrote:
Q1 ) Why E not C


the only difference between (c) and (e) is idiomatic expression.
you don't say "dated to be..."; you do say "dated at...".

like other idiomatic expressions, this is one of those things that doesn't go according to any sort of logical rule; you just have to know it.
you should dedicate a page or two of a notebook to this, or make some flash cards for the ones you don't know.


This is what Ron has to say about DATED AT & DATED TO BE.

The rule is applicable with other expression with other expressions like ESTIMATED or ESTIMATED TO BE.

HTH


din get what you said
Ron said that estimated at should be followed by a noun
for other cases we use estimated to be
and og says dated to be 300 million years old.
this is my confusion.
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souvik101990 wrote:
jaiswalamrita wrote:
souvik101990 wrote:
yeah thats what i am trying
EXPERTS, EXPERTS WHERE ART THOU?



kramacha1979 wrote:
wrote:
Q1 ) Why E not C


the only difference between (c) and (e) is idiomatic expression.
you don't say "dated to be..."; you do say "dated at...".

like other idiomatic expressions, this is one of those things that doesn't go according to any sort of logical rule; you just have to know it.
you should dedicate a page or two of a notebook to this, or make some flash cards for the ones you don't know.


This is what Ron has to say about DATED AT & DATED TO BE.

The rule is applicable with other expression with other expressions like ESTIMATED or ESTIMATED TO BE.

HTH


din get what you said
Ron said that estimated at should be followed by a noun
for other cases we use estimated to be
and og says dated to be 300 million years old.
this is my confusion.


Ok...He says..
'Estimated at' should be followed by a noun because it follows a preposition 'at' which always takes Noun. Eg. This monument is estimated at 300 mn years.
If we say 'This monument is estimated at 300 mn years old' then its wrong because '300 mn year old' is an adjective whereas '300 mn year' is noun.

In any case if we have to use '300 mn years old', we'll say 'This monument is estimated to be 300 mn years old'.

He further says this rule is not applicable to 'Dated at' and 'Dated to be' because 'Dated to be' is non idiomatic..It doesn't work, I means natives do not use 'dated to be' anywhere. Hence 'Dated to be' is always wrong irrespective of what it follows (a noun or an adjective).

HTH

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Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are
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Concept tested: Idioms, SV agreement
Difficulty Level: Moderate
Illustration: “Rock samples” is the subject for the verb “has been dated”. Rock samples must take a plural verb.
So A and B can be instantly eliminated.
Dated at is the correct idiomatic construction.
So C and D are also eliminated
E is the correct answer choice

Tip: Though “dated at” is preferred to “dated to be”, the same construction is not necessarily true for “estimated at” and “estimated to be” construction.
“Estimated at” should be followed by a noun because “at” is a preposition.
E.g: The molten iron is estimated at 1500 degrees Celsius.
“Estimated to be” generally follows phrases
E.g: The fossil is estimated to be 1000 years old.

This is NOT a specific English rule, but the way GMAT wants things to be
Support is given by:
In OG 12, Q 27 of SC, it says that the correct idiom is "estimated to be".
However this question appears in gmatprep
"With surface temperatures estimated at minus 230 degrees Farenheit, Jupiter's moon Europa has long been considered far too cold to support life, and with 60 square miles of water though to be frozen from top to bottom."

We can see from the non underlined part that "estimated at" is also as correct idiom.
Takeaway: Same rules do not apply to "estimated to be" and "dated to be"
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souvik101990 wrote:
Rock samples taken from the remains of an asteroid about twice the size of the 6-mile-wide asteroid that eradicated the dinosaurs has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is evidence of the earliest known asteroid impact on Earth.

(A) has been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus is
(B) has been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus
(C) have been dated to be 3.47 billion years old and thus are
(D) have been dated as being 3.47 billion years old and thus
(E) have been dated at 3.47 billion years old and thus are


As rightly written by @Archillees - SV Agreement error >

Also to note is Difference between C and E
C uses subjunctive form - "to be" which is not required here.
E uses correct idiom "dated at"
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souvik101990 wrote:
Before moving to OE
What is the correct idiom for:
estimated to be Vs estimated at?


I guess it would depend how one is using these 2 expressions,
estimated at = uses at which is a preposition, so it would need a noun!

estimated to be - I think it should work when referring with respect to some verb!!!

I remember Ron discussed something on similar lines on an another forum.....
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New post 22 Sep 2012, 13:38
@methevoid
You got it correct.
But this logic doesn't apply in this question does it?
Dated at is used against a phrase which is not a noun.
Weird things GMAT does.
The OE for this question is based on this specific fallacy in the GMAT.
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