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While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90

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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 24 Dec 2017, 11:56
1
Leo8 wrote:
@Experts - Please advise!.

To me Option A was a loud winner as it stands alone with S-V agreement.

But thinking on "Meaning" issue - bogged me down. and I forced myself to find issues in A

as I was confused about the verb "attest" which stands for " serve as Evidence"

How can the object itself attest of some view about a past event?
It has to be the finding of that object can attest the view.


I think you already answered your question! If the word "attest" means "serve as evidence", then it's completely fine to say that the object itself "attests", right? In this case: "... waterlogged latex balls serve as evidence for the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established by the mid-thirteenth century, b.c." It actually makes perfect sense, even if you just replace "attest" with its definition.

To be fair, it is a little bit unusual in real life (at least in American English) to use "attest" with an inanimate object, but when we think about the exact definition of "attest", it's completely fine.

I hope this helps!
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 01 Feb 2018, 19:39
While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 900–400 b.c., waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest to the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established by the mid-thirteenth century b.c.

(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest

(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests

(C) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests

(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

This question is mostly about the meaning of the original sentence. Which pair of subjects is most logically deduce from "ballgame was well established"?
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 25 May 2018, 00:14
Could any expert revise if I am wrong?

Option E is out because of the SV agreement.

If I revise option E in the following way, is it right gramatically?

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the finding of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

There are 2 findings together to attest. The subject is plural.

Thanks in advance!

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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 25 May 2018, 13:05
2
scwong59 wrote:
Could any expert revise if I am wrong?

Option E is out because of the SV agreement.

If I revise option E in the following way, is it right gramatically?

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the finding of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

There are 2 findings together to attest. The subject is plural.

Thanks in advance!

Best,
Laurie




Hello scwong59 / Laurie,


I will be glad to help you out with this one. :-)


Following is the structure of the sentence with Choice E:


While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 900–400 b.c.,

the finding

    of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and

    of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo


attest to the fact

that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established by the mid-thirteenth century b.c.




The sentence intends to say that there was one finding. Two items were found, but there was one finding that took place. Hence, we need singular verb attests for the finding.


From grammar stand-point, the finding applies to both of waterlogged... and of representations.... Hence, this singular subject needs singular verb attests.


Hope this helps. :-)
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 02 Aug 2018, 20:11
While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 900–400 b.c., waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest to the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established by the mid-thirteenth century b.c.

(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest
(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(C) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests
(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

First of all, we need to compare 'ball courts in Mesoamerica' with 'waterlogged latex balls and painting of representations of ballplayers'. Hence, option E is out.

List of two items - 'waterlogged latex balls and painting of representations of ballplayers' - needs plural verb - 'attest', hence 'B, C, and D' are out.

Correct Answer Choice is 'A'
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 07 Aug 2018, 09:35
Experts have done a tremendous job explaining this question; anyway, I'm just tossing my two cents.

If you focus only on Subject-Verb Agreement issue, you'll see that only (A) uses the correct agreement - Compound Noun Subject (Plural) - Verb (Plural)


(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest - Subject-Verb Agreement.

(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests - Subject - Verb Disagreement

(C)waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests - Subject - Verb Disagreement

(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests - Subject - Verb Disagreement

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest - Subject - Verb Disagreement
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 15 Aug 2018, 17:38
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Hello Everyone!

Let's take a look at this question to find any ways to quickly rule out options to get us to the correct answer! First, here is the original question with the main differences between each option highlighted in orange:

While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 900–400 b.c., waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest to the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established by the mid-thirteenth century b.c.

(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest
(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(C) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests
(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

Right away, we see 3 places where there are differences between each option:

1. How they begin (waterlogged latex balls found / the finding of waterlogged latex balls)
2. How they end (attest / attests)
3. How they deal with the ceramic paintings of ballplayers


To answer this question as quickly as possible, start with an item on our list that will eliminate 2-3 answers right away. For us, the easiest way to do this is by dealing with #2 on our list: attest / attests.

The verb "attest/attests" is referring back to BOTH the waterlogged latex balls and the ceramic paintings; therefore, we MUST use the plural verb "attest" to agree with its plural subject! Let's see how each option stacks up:

(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest
(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(C) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests
(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests
(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

We can eliminate options B, C, and D quickly because they use a singular verb with a plural subject!

Now that we only have options A & E to choose from, let's look at both answers to see which one is the better choice:

(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest

This is the CORRECT answer because it uses the correct plural verb "attest" to agree with its plural subject. It also uses clear and concise wording to convey the intended meaning: the two types of artifacts found are proof the game existed at that time!

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

This is INCORRECT because it changes the original meaning. The phrases "the finding of waterlogged latex balls" and the finding "of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics" change the focus. By saying "the finding of" these two artifacts is the proof of how long this game existed, we're ignoring the important fact that the existence of these two artifacts is the proof - NOT the action of someone finding them!

There you go - option A is the correct choice!


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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 14 Sep 2018, 03:00
GMATNinja wrote:
Hm, they found waterlogged latex balls in Mesoamerica from 900-400 b.c.?!? Wow, the 2018 OG is more interesting than I expected. (My copy of it is looking at me right now. I've barely had time to open it. :( )

TheMechanic wrote:
Eliminating option D took a while. Besides D being wordier than A, is there any thing else in D which renders it incorrect?

I think we could also argue that (D) doesn't really convey the meaning of the sentence as clearly as (A). In each answer choice, what is it that "attests to the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established..."? In (A), it's the waterlogged balls themselves and the representations of the ballplayers that give us information about the ballgame -- and that makes a lot of sense. In (D), it's "the finding" (of the balls) and "the painting" (of the representations) that tells us about the history of the ballgame -- and that makes much less sense to me.

I'm not 100% sure that (D) would be absolutely wrong in isolation, but it conveys the meaning much less clearly than (A).

I hope this helps!





In D plural subject does not agree with "attests"
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 15 Sep 2018, 14:21
kablayi wrote:
GMATNinja wrote:
Hm, they found waterlogged latex balls in Mesoamerica from 900-400 b.c.?!? Wow, the 2018 OG is more interesting than I expected. (My copy of it is looking at me right now. I've barely had time to open it. :( )

TheMechanic wrote:
Eliminating option D took a while. Besides D being wordier than A, is there any thing else in D which renders it incorrect?

I think we could also argue that (D) doesn't really convey the meaning of the sentence as clearly as (A). In each answer choice, what is it that "attests to the fact that the Mesoamerican ballgame was well established..."? In (A), it's the waterlogged balls themselves and the representations of the ballplayers that give us information about the ballgame -- and that makes a lot of sense. In (D), it's "the finding" (of the balls) and "the painting" (of the representations) that tells us about the history of the ballgame -- and that makes much less sense to me.

I'm not 100% sure that (D) would be absolutely wrong in isolation, but it conveys the meaning much less clearly than (A).

I hope this helps!


In D plural subject does not agree with "attests"

Yes! And I proudly(?) accepted my demerits above: https://gmatclub.com/forum/while-most-o ... l#p1877969.
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 23 Sep 2018, 03:14
Can any one explain why E is wrong ?
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 25 Oct 2018, 20:56
(A) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attest

(B) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests

(C) waterlogged latex balls found at El Manati and ceramics painted with representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo attests

(D) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests

(E) the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest
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While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 17 Jan 2019, 21:03
Can not "the finding of ... and the painting of..." and
"the finding of ... and of the painting of..." mean the same thing?

If a finding contains two things, the "of" before the second thing cannot be omitted?

Could someone please help explain?
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jan 2019, 03:19
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skycastle19 wrote:
Can not "the finding of ... and the painting of..." and
"the finding of ... and of the painting of..." mean the same thing?

If a finding contains two things, the "of" before the second thing cannot be omitted?

Could someone please help explain?

There's no general rule governing this issue. Context is everything here.

Take another look at (D): "the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests..."

In this option we have two things attesting to the fact that this game was established by the 13th century B.C.: (1) the finding of waterlogged balls at El Manati and (2) the painting of representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo.

If we had an "of" before the second element, the parallelism would change. Now, the two elements in bold would be parallel to each other: "the finding (1) of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and (2) of the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests..." Take a look at that second element now: "the finding... of the painting of representations found at San Lorenzo." We could refer to "the finding of X at San Lorenzo". We could refer to "X found at San Lorenzo". But we can't refer to "the finding of X found at San Lorenzo". That's redundant.

(Of course, others have pointed out that (D) has a subject-verb disagreement: X and Y attests, and this is probably the easiest way to get rid of this option.)

Now let's revisit (E): "the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest..." The structure is different here: "found" doesn't appear in the second element, so we don't have the redundancy issue anymore. But we still have a subject-verb disagreement: "the finding... attest." So (E) is wrong regardless.

Takeaway (shouted very loudly from a snowy rooftop): it's impossible to memorize every acceptable construction or idiom on the GMAT. With a few exceptions, you're far better off relying on the logic, grammar, and structure of a given option than attempting to rely on an ironclad rule.

I hope that helps!
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 22 Jan 2019, 06:18
GMATNinja wrote:
skycastle19 wrote:
Can not "the finding of ... and the painting of..." and
"the finding of ... and of the painting of..." mean the same thing?

If a finding contains two things, the "of" before the second thing cannot be omitted?

Could someone please help explain?

There's no general rule governing this issue. Context is everything here.

Take another look at (D): "the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests..."

In this option we have two things attesting to the fact that this game was established by the 13th century B.C.: (1) the finding of waterlogged balls at El Manati and (2) the painting of representations of ballplayers found at San Lorenzo.

If we had an "of" before the second element, the parallelism would change. Now, the two elements in bold would be parallel to each other: "the finding (1) of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and (2) of the painting of representations of ballplayers on ceramics found at San Lorenzo attests..." Take a look at that second element now: "the finding... of the painting of representations found at San Lorenzo." We could refer to "the finding of X at San Lorenzo". We could refer to "X found at San Lorenzo". But we can't refer to "the finding of X found at San Lorenzo". That's redundant.

(Of course, others have pointed out that (D) has a subject-verb disagreement: X and Y attests, and this is probably the easiest way to get rid of this option.)

Now let's revisit (E): "the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest..." The structure is different here: "found" doesn't appear in the second element, so we don't have the redundancy issue anymore. But we still have a subject-verb disagreement: "the finding... attest." So (E) is wrong regardless.

Takeaway (shouted very loudly from a snowy rooftop): it's impossible to memorize every acceptable construction or idiom on the GMAT. With a few exceptions, you're far better off relying on the logic, grammar, and structure of a given option than attempting to rely on an ironclad rule.

I hope that helps!


Great explanation and suggestions!!! Thank you a lot Ninja!!!
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 17 May 2019, 21:34
Love youuuuuuu egmat . Such tiny S-V agreement almost missed by eyes. Although I chose A because of more clarity . Now I have got a 100% reason to eliminate option E


egmat wrote:
dabhishek87 wrote:
Between A and E, I chose E.
Can someone please explain why E is wrong? Is it just because of concision?
I did not fully understood that in E, two phrases are not grammatically parallel as mentioned by @pusphitkc




Hello dabhishek87,


I would be glad to help you with your query. :)

Let me bring in Choice E here: the finding of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo attest

Let's first take a look at the parallel list per Choice E: the finding

    of waterlogged latex balls at El Manati and
    of representations of ballplayers painted on ceramics at San Lorenzo

Alright, so now the subject of the main clause is the singular noun the finding that has plural verb attest. So we definitely have the subject-verb number agreement error in this choice.

IMHO, the list is grammatical.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90  [#permalink]

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New post 03 Jul 2019, 00:26
dabhishek87 wrote:
Between A and E, I chose E.
Can someone please explain why E is wrong? Is it just because of concision?
I did not fully understood that in E, two phrases are not grammatically parallel as mentioned by @pusphitkc




E is wrong because the finding of X and Y is singular and needs a singular verb "attests"
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Re: While most of the earliest known ball courts in Mesoamerica date to 90   [#permalink] 03 Jul 2019, 00:26

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