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How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?

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How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?  [#permalink]

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New post 10 Jul 2019, 08:56
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Post MBA Goal: Strategy Consulting in global office of MBB firm (apart from India)
VISA issues : Yes - Asian (Indian).
Which school (INSEAD or LBS) will give me better chances/has had better statistics in the past to send Indians in overseas offices (not necessarily to India offices) to work in global office of MBB ?

Any help from experts/past students/current applicants will immensely help!

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New post 10 Jul 2019, 09:33
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sushiboy wrote:
Post MBA Goal: Strategy Consulting in global office of MBB firm (apart from India)
VISA issues : Yes - Asian (Indian).
Which school (INSEAD or LBS) will give me better chances/has had better statistics in the past to send Indians in overseas offices (not necessarily to India offices) to work in global office of MBB ?

Any help from experts/past students/current applicants will immensely help!

Cheers


INSEAD is by far the global MBB powerhouse. Highest numbers and % for MBB amongst top MBA programmes. Whilst LBS is decent too, they are primarily more focused on the London office.

You can check out the employment reports of both INSEAD and LBS. The numbers are telling.
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New post 10 Jul 2019, 09:45
A. INSEAD has a bigger batch size than LBS
B. Both have sponsored students

So lets look at % of fresh new hires students is the data to go for.

Both have around 16% of their total class going into MBB. So its almost similar! :(
Want to work in London/Middle East offices.
LBS will have advantage in that case ?
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New post 10 Jul 2019, 09:52
sushiboy wrote:
A. INSEAD has a bigger batch size than LBS
B. Both have sponsored students

So lets look at % of fresh new hires students is the data to go for.

Both have around 16% of their total class going into MBB. So its almost similar! :(
Want to work in London/Middle East offices.
LBS will have advantage in that case ?


I'd say London LBS might have slight advantage. Rest of Europe, INSEAD has the advantage.

Middle East is clearly INSEAD due to the Abu Dhabi campus which MBA students of the July Class get the option of spending a Period there.
LBS has a Dubai campus but it's only for exec programmes, not for MBA.
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Re: How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?  [#permalink]

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New post 10 Jul 2019, 13:55
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sushiboy wrote:
A. INSEAD has a bigger batch size than LBS
B. Both have sponsored students

So lets look at % of fresh new hires students is the data to go for.

Both have around 16% of their total class going into MBB. So its almost similar! :(
Want to work in London/Middle East offices.
LBS will have advantage in that case ?


Hey!

I think in terms of chances of getting a job at MBB, both rank the same. The eventual difference boils down to finer points that could be more personal to your choice. My vote is LBS, here's why:

    1. A 2-year degree gives you more time to intern at consulting firms and build a case for yourself, especially in case you haven't had experience in consulting or banking or PE etc before
    2. You can definitely choose to intern at the Dubai office of the consulting firms when they visit the campus for internships. I honestly don't think you need access to campus in the Middle East to land an internship or job there. The brand (& networking, of course) are enough
    3. LBS gives you the advantage of location. Most of INSEAD students have to plan travels to London from Fonty/Singapore to meet up with consulting firms in the city. You simply have to hop on the tube
    4. However, if you do have consulting experience and are pretty sure you want to go back to consulting but maybe go in a better brand, then a 2-year degree might be a bit of a stretch for you

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New post 10 Jul 2019, 22:09
GMATin wrote:
sushiboy wrote:
A. INSEAD has a bigger batch size than LBS
B. Both have sponsored students

So lets look at % of fresh new hires students is the data to go for.

Both have around 16% of their total class going into MBB. So its almost similar! :(
Want to work in London/Middle East offices.
LBS will have advantage in that case ?


Hey!

I think in terms of chances of getting a job at MBB, both rank the same. The eventual difference boils down to finer points that could be more personal to your choice. My vote is LBS, here's why:

    1. A 2-year degree gives you more time to intern at consulting firms and build a case for yourself, especially in case you haven't had experience in consulting or banking or PE etc before
    2. You can definitely choose to intern at the Dubai office of the consulting firms when they visit the campus for internships. I honestly don't think you need access to campus in the Middle East to land an internship or job there. The brand (& networking, of course) are enough
    3. LBS gives you the advantage of location. Most of INSEAD students have to plan travels to London from Fonty/Singapore to meet up with consulting firms in the city. You simply have to hop on the tube
    4. However, if you do have consulting experience and are pretty sure you want to go back to consulting but maybe go in a better brand, then a 2-year degree might be a bit of a stretch for you



Yeah
1. I dont have experience in consulting prior. I am going to transition into consulting and also changing geography. So a 2 year would help.
2. Summer Internship in boutique consulting etc is easier to get at London- due to the number of such firms.
3. But I doubt if my no prior experience in consulting (coming from R&D background) will keep me at a disadvantage to get into a summer internship at boutique/MBB firms in London or elsewhere.
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Re: How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?  [#permalink]

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New post 10 Jul 2019, 23:09
Did you get admitted already? This makes it sound you are, just wanted to make sure.
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New post Updated on: 11 Jul 2019, 03:17
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Quote:
1. I dont have experience in consulting prior. I am going to transition into consulting and also changing geography. So a 2 year would help.
2. Summer Internship in boutique consulting etc is easier to get at London- due to the number of such firms.
3. But I doubt if my no prior experience in consulting (coming from R&D background) will keep me at a disadvantage to get into a summer internship at boutique/MBB firms in London or elsewhere.


I think the added value of the additional year depends greatly on your primary motivation for getting an MBA in the first place.
I've been trying to decide the following points for myself:

In my opinion, one of the biggest factors in deciding between a one-year or a two-year program is prior work experience. Do you believe you can convince MBB that you can do the work and add value to the firm?
- If you have more significant work experience, it probably means that you've supervised projects before, that you can manage deadlines and employees, and that you can offer valuable insights in at least one industry. In case this is true for you, chances are you need the MBA from a top school as an additional "seal of approval" from a top business school, and you might benefit less from an additional year of rigorous coursework.
- I think prior consulting experience is definitely not a must at MBB (I read about a musician that was hired at McKinsey for consulting) as long as you can convince them that you can do the work.
- Obviously, MBB is exclusive. If something about your work experience or academic record makes you doubt that MBB would be fully blown out of the water, the summer internship can add tremendous value and dramatically improve your chances of getting a job there (which I'm sure you've considered). It allows the firm to consider you as a candidate without the VISA problem, eliminates some of the prerequisite work experience to be taken seriously, and often leads to a full-time offer.

Additionally, it's obviously important to consider why you want to get an MBA. Are you using the degree primarily to get to MBB? How highly do you value the coursework and the relationships?
- Obviously, two years of courses and meeting people will have a more lasting impact than one year. One academic year can be fairly short, especially considering international experience requirements that might limit time spent on campus and out meeting people. In addition, there's recruiting, which starts almost immediately, and preparing for case studies, which you will also be doing a lot of (pretty much from the first day you get to campus).
- Two-year programs also give you more opportunities to take courses in areas you might not have the time to learn more about in the shorter time at a one-year program.
- On the other hand, some candidates with more experience, or candidates going into a very specific role, might not benefit as much from the coursework. Will a healthcare consultant in Germany need to know how to do business in China? Does a healthcare consultant need to know how to use R and Python? Probably not.
- The financial opportunity cost of postponing earning money for an additional year definitely matters too. For candidates with families or with student loans, minimizing the time spent out of the workforce is definitely a significant perk of a one-year program.

You appear to be in the enviable position of choosing between programs at two exceptional schools. Probably really can't go too wrong either way :)

Originally posted by Jbrandl1 on 11 Jul 2019, 00:19.
Last edited by Jbrandl1 on 11 Jul 2019, 03:17, edited 1 time in total.
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New post Updated on: 12 Jul 2019, 18:04
Helpful article comparing the 2 schools

https://find-mba.com/articles/mba-school-choice-insead-vs-lbs

Posted from my mobile device
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Originally posted by MBAPrepCoach on 11 Jul 2019, 01:03.
Last edited by MBAPrepCoach on 12 Jul 2019, 18:04, edited 1 time in total.
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New post 11 Jul 2019, 01:07
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Couple days ago I asked one of my former clients about his views on the pros and cons of INSEAD. He's from Montreal,just graduated.

Hey Farrell, thanks a lot for your message!

INSEAD was great, very stimulating I would say. IMO, and this is very personal:

Pros: 
- Opportunity cost is lower than 2 years MBA and makes more sense for older candidates
- Alumni is truly strong
- Great to change geographies. INSEAD alumni are everywhere globally and this really helps
- Great consulting gateway

Cons:
- One year is really short for business school.
- Too short to do some deep introspection and "exploring' different career options
- Too short to really go deep in each topic studied. It's ok for someone with a business background but a non-business background candidate might struggle or not get really extensive learning of basics of business 
-  It's a consulting school. Career service is probably the best in the world if objective is to go to MBB or 2nd tier consulting but candidates who want to go in finance for example are a bit left on their own and need to hustle through personal network

Hope this helps!
cheers

THEN I asked some follow ups re: rigours of the program and lifetime network:

Classes were definitely interesting and the professors are great but each period is 7-8weeks.

How deep can you really go in 7 weeks... Difficult for me to benchmark vs US schools.

There is a big workload in the first 4 months where you take all the core courses but one will only learn as much as they are willing to put an effort on doing the readings, etc.

Yes more of a social event and the 30-40% of sponsored students is probably the main reason for it.

Yes, I surely built a nice network within my cohort and across other batches.



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New post 11 Jul 2019, 03:21
Jbrandl1 wrote:
Quote:
1. I dont have experience in consulting prior. I am going to transition into consulting and also changing geography. So a 2 year would help.
2. Summer Internship in boutique consulting etc is easier to get at London- due to the number of such firms.
3. But I doubt if my no prior experience in consulting (coming from R&D background) will keep me at a disadvantage to get into a summer internship at boutique/MBB firms in London or elsewhere.


I think the added value of the additional year depends greatly on your primary motivation for getting an MBA in the first place.
I've been trying to decide the following points for myself:

In my opinion, one of the biggest factors in deciding between a one-year or a two-year program is prior work experience. Do you believe you can convince MBB that you can do the work and add value to the firm?
- If you have more significant work experience, it probably means that you've supervised projects before, that you can manage deadlines and employees, and that you can offer valuable insights in at least one industry. In case this is true for you, changes are you need the MBA from a top school as an additional "seal of approval" from a top business school, and you might benefit less from an additional year of rigorous coursework.
- I think prior consulting experience is definitely not a must at MBB (I read about a musician that was hired at McKinsey for consulting) as long as you can convince them that you can do the work.
- Obviously, MBB is exclusive. If something about your work experience or academic record makes you doubt that MBB would be fully blown out of the water, the summer internship can add tremendous value and dramatically improve your chances of getting a job there (which I'm sure you've considered). It allows the firm to consider you as a candidate without the VISA problem, eliminates some of the prerequisite work experience to be taken seriously, and often leads to a full-time offer.

Additionally, it's obviously important to consider why you want to get an MBA. Are you using the degree primarily to get to MBB? How highly do you value the coursework and the relationships?
- Obviously, two years of courses and meeting people will have a more lasting impact than one year. One academic year can be fairly short, especially considering international experience requirements that might limit time spent on campus and out meeting people. In addition, there's recruiting, which starts almost immediately, and preparing for case studies, which you will also be doing a lot of (pretty much from the first day you get to campus).
- Two-year programs also give you more opportunities to take courses in areas you might not have the time to learn more about in the shorter time at a one-year program.
- On the other hand, some candidates with more experience, or candidates going into a very specific role, might not benefit as much from the coursework. Will a healthcare consultant in Germany need to know how to do business in China? Does a healthcare consultant need to know how to use R and Python? Probably not.
- The financial opportunity cost of postponing earning money for an additional year definitely matters too. For candidates with families or with student loans, minimizing the time spent out of the workforce is definitely a significant perk of a one-year program.

You appear to be in the enviable position of choosing between programs at two exceptional schools. Probably really can't go too wrong either way :)


Thanks man for those detailed insights!
Here is my take on going for an MBA
- Coming from a R&D non-business background, I have found consulting to be more interesting simply because of the visible impact of one's work and also the breadth of industries that one gets exposed to. So a career switch through MBA is the main idea here. Definitely forging life-long relationships and enjoying my 20s is a big idea for me. London or Fonty - no brainer here. :) (Merci, je suis Fonty)
- I have led teams and projects , managed deadlines but can offer insights only into R&D of medical devices - more as an engineering lead than into the business of medical devices. And looking at London offices of MBB, which are super tough - and are more involved in healthcare business projects- i am a bit unsure about the value I would bring to the table.
- About the USP and value I bring to the table. So my previous work exp is in healthcare but r&d. Healthcare being such a vast area, I would have to make grounds in efforts to broaden my expertise or experience. Say for ex- I need to increase my experience in the business of healthcare I will like to take finance, accounting, marketing based courses, work in consulting clubs, summer internship and slowly build from there. So yeah a more relaxed 2 year MBA would help which an INSEAD-J admit wont provide.
Your thoughts !?
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Re: How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?  [#permalink]

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New post 11 Jul 2019, 13:37
Quote:
Your thoughts !?


Ofc! I certainly defer to any admissions counselors and admissions officers on the topic, however. I'm not sure what adds more value to an application at MBB: going to THE consulting powerhouse INSEAD, or the possibly slightly less competitive summer internship application pool. Maybe MBAPrepCoach can help with this?

I'd also keep in mind, that while consultants definitely have a more strategic, direct impact on business decisions than a research analyst, consultants obviously have partners and company C-suite that truly make the decisions. Consultants I know have often mentioned that an "ideal outcome" has been provided, and recommendations should be in-line with that outcome.

It's also true, that most consultants don't end up staying consultants forever. I believe post-MBA consultants stay for approx. 2-4 years. Therefore, I would consider the possibility that consulting might be your 5 year plan, not necessarily what you do for the next 20 years.

From what you've shared about yourself, it does sound like you could take advantage of the additional year of business education that a longer program would offer. Given that an MBA is often the last formal education for a professional in business, I would consider that aspect, too

I wouldn't count on the two-year program being a lot more "relaxed," though, especially not in the first year ;). On the other hand, year-two should definitely offer some time to pick electives you're especially interested in, brush up on some core business subjects you feel you might really need extra help in, and some time out with friends.
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Re: How to choose LBS vs INSEAD ?  [#permalink]

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New post 11 Jul 2019, 23:57
Jbrandl1 wrote:
Quote:
Your thoughts !?


Ofc! I certainly defer to any admissions counselors and admissions officers on the topic, however. I'm not sure what adds more value to an application at MBB: going to THE consulting powerhouse INSEAD, or the possibly slightly less competitive summer internship application pool. Maybe MBAPrepCoach can help with this?

I'd also keep in mind, that while consultants definitely have a more strategic, direct impact on business decisions than a research analyst, consultants obviously have partners and company C-suite that truly make the decisions. Consultants I know have often mentioned that an "ideal outcome" has been provided, and recommendations should be in-line with that outcome.

It's also true, that most consultants don't end up staying consultants forever. I believe post-MBA consultants stay for approx. 2-4 years. Therefore, I would consider the possibility that consulting might be your 5 year plan, not necessarily what you do for the next 20 years.

From what you've shared about yourself, it does sound like you could take advantage of the additional year of business education that a longer program would offer. Given that an MBA is often the last formal education for a professional in business, I would consider that aspect, too

I wouldn't count on the two-year program being a lot more "relaxed," though, especially not in the first year ;). On the other hand, year-two should definitely offer some time to pick electives you're especially interested in, brush up on some core business subjects you feel you might really need extra help in, and some time out with friends.


After talking to a lot of people and introspection I came to realize that I need to choose schools based on my profile, since placements post MBA is tricky and depends on your profile. (more than generic facts like INSEAD consuting powerhouse/HBS good for consulting etc )
- People Transitioning into consulting is a broad pool of people - people with business related prior jobs such as PE people, IBankers , Entreprenuers etc and non business related pool including PhDs, scientists and R&D engineers.
If we rank the applicant workstream which has similar or close to consulting in terms of relevance would be (from highest to lowest)
1. IBankers
2. PE
3. Entrepreneurs
4. Ops/Supply chain
5. R&D Engineers (who have quant intensive work)
4. Phds in Maths, Economics or other quant related skills
5. Researchers in Biology ( relevant because of industry specialization)

If you see, 1,2,3,4 and 5 are most relevant because of their work which deals with hard numbers and taking real life decisions or devising strategy based on that. This appeals a lot to MBB firms because thats what they deal with in their daily lives.

So considering this pool I will rank myself in 5. An MBA can help me in
- providing reach to my class peers/alumni in consulting (networking is king)
- immersing myself in business related coursework (finance, accounting , strategy, marketing, ops etc) to learn those concepts well
- Developng my interest in consulting and practicing cases through consulting club/organize networking events for consultants
- Do an internship in a boutique consulting firm and gain some first hand experience to know how 'fit' I am for consulting
- Taking electives which can help me to better position myself as a MBB applicant with my prior work experience in healthcare.

Considering all of these. - LBS is more suitable than a fast track INSEAD which is more for people already with decent knowledge of business matters/ seasoned professionals looking for a solid brand.
Oh hey and btw I am in the application stage. I need to decide the right application round :(
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New post 12 Jul 2019, 18:10
Re: your question, I think it's a draw - and it's best to focus on tackling case interviews. Lots of sponsored students at both schools to help.

Jbrandl1 wrote:
Quote:
Your thoughts !?


Ofc! I certainly defer to any admissions counselors and admissions officers on the topic, however. I'm not sure what adds more value to an application at MBB: going to THE consulting powerhouse INSEAD, or the possibly slightly less competitive summer internship application pool. Maybe MBAPrepCoach can help with this?

I'd also keep in mind, that while consultants definitely have a more strategic, direct impact on business decisions than a research analyst, consultants obviously have partners and company C-suite that truly make the decisions. Consultants I know have often mentioned that an "ideal outcome" has been provided, and recommendations should be in-line with that outcome.

It's also true, that most consultants don't end up staying consultants forever. I believe post-MBA consultants stay for approx. 2-4 years. Therefore, I would consider the possibility that consulting might be your 5 year plan, not necessarily what you do for the next 20 years.

From what you've shared about yourself, it does sound like you could take advantage of the additional year of business education that a longer program would offer. Given that an MBA is often the last formal education for a professional in business, I would consider that aspect, too

I wouldn't count on the two-year program being a lot more "relaxed," though, especially not in the first year ;). On the other hand, year-two should definitely offer some time to pick electives you're especially interested in, brush up on some core business subjects you feel you might really need extra help in, and some time out with friends.

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New post 13 Jul 2019, 07:40
Happy to see so much interaction here!

I can´t really add information beyond what has already been stated.
As this question might come up frequently I would invite our very own billionaire to chime in. :)

Best regards,
Chris
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New post 13 Jul 2019, 08:51
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Hey guys

Which school would you suggest would be better for a non-business related MBA applicant ( coming from healthcare R&D profile) who wants to join in MBB as a strategy consultant ?
Applying for INSEAD Sep, since deadlines clash with LBS.

Plan A : Consulting MBB, Top 4
Plan B : Healthcare jobs- think J&J, Medtronics, GSK, Novartis
Plan C: Tech - Apple/Samsung etc
Preferred post MBA Job Location : London, UK

Now I am confused which to choose-

INSEAD Sep Admit
Pros
1. Consulting Heavy - so lots of opportunities in this sector
2. Also see lot more healthcare companies in information brochure - Pfizer, Sanofi etc.

Cons
1. Program is too short - fear it might be difficult to grasp for someone coming from non-business related job type.
2. No internship - cant get some experience to build my profile for consulting/any other sector.

LBS Pros
1. A longer 15 month period - has internship too - so officialy 2 chances to get into MBB/explore Plan B/C.
2. A relatively longer MBA duration means learning key business concepts at a relaxed pace.- 15 months can be made 18/21 - so more flexible.
Cons
1. Less healthcare job opportunities ?

Would really appreciate if some applicant/currentstudent/alumni who had a similar situation ( coming from a non-business profile ) could help me out!
Cheers!
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New post 13 Jul 2019, 10:07
My Pick would be LBS for the below-mentioned reasons:

1) Your Preferred Location - UK
2) Since you are from a non- business background, you need time to understand the concepts and you need an internship to get a reality check before you enter the respective field.

I don't see any reasons for not going ahead with LBS.

Kudos if you found it valuable.
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New post 10 Aug 2019, 08:17
Have you made a decision yet? :)

I would be very interested to learn the outcome of your perils (for which I do envy you a lot :) ).

Cheers,
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