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705-805 Level|   Modifiers|   Subjunctive|         
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 11 May 2016, 12:57
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souvik101990
Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

A. that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are

B. that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

C. to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are

D. to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills

E. to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills
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Require can be used in both the ways- require that and require to . I want to find out why option E is wrong. Is it because the structure of option E "Require of X to pay" is a bit awkward?

Please explain why E is incorrect?


With thanks,

Yaman
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 13 May 2016, 11:05
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yaman1203
souvik101990
Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

A. that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are

B. that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

C. to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are

D. to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills

E. to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills


Require can be used in both the ways- require that and require to . I want to find out why option E is wrong. Is it because the structure of option E "Require of X to pay" is a bit awkward?

Please explain why E is incorrect?


With thanks,

Yaman
Show more

Not just awkward.. it is outright wrong - following are the correct usages (probably you missed my previous post):

1. Require someone to do something: correct
2. Require OF someone to do something: wrong
3. Require OF someone that ...command subjunctive...: correct
4. Require OF someone that ..should... : wrong
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 03 Jan 2017, 11:13
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understandZERO
Why in answer choice A word "skill" considered as plural followed by verb "are".
I eliminated A because I thought skill is singular here. Why "require that" is preferred over "require to".
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"That" refers to "jobs" - hence "that" is plural, and the verb "are" should also be plural. Jobs (not skills) are held by men.
"Requiring comparable skill" modifies "jobs" and the second modifier "that are usually held by men" refer to the noun and the previous modifier together. (This is an example of an exception to the modifier touch rule).
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 10 Jun 2017, 08:04
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are
(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

Usually "that" will NOT jump noun. Could expert help to explain the relative pronoun "that" in this question?

Examples of relative clauses:
Hurricanes that are born off the coast of Africa often prove to be the most deadly.
Film that has been exposed to X rays often produces poor photographs.
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 11 Jun 2017, 17:05
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hazelnut
Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are
(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

Usually "that" will NOT jump noun. Could expert help to explain the relative pronoun "that" in this question?

Examples of relative clauses:
Hurricanes that are born off the coast of Africa often prove to be the most deadly.
Film that has been exposed to X rays often produces poor photographs.
Show more
The first "that" introduces a noun clause: legislation requires what? ... "that pay be the same..."

It does NOT, however, introduce a noun modifier to describe "pay". In other words, the "that" clause is the object of the verb "requires" and not a modifier describing "pay", so there is no issue with choice (A).
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 11 Jun 2017, 17:26
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GMATNinja
hazelnut
Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

The first "that" introduces a noun clause: legislation requires what? ... "that pay be the same..."

It does NOT, however, introduce a noun modifier to describe "pay". In other words, the "that" clause is the object of the verb "requires" and not a modifier describing "pay", so there is no issue with choice (A).
Show more

Hi GMATNinja, How about the second "that" in that sentence? Common sense, "that are usually held by men" should modify "jobs". However, the preceding noun "comparable skill" is placed before the relative pronoun "that".

Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 16 Jun 2017, 19:59
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hazelnut
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

The first "that" introduces a noun clause: legislation requires what? ... "that pay be the same..."

It does NOT, however, introduce a noun modifier to describe "pay". In other words, the "that" clause is the object of the verb "requires" and not a modifier describing "pay", so there is no issue with choice (A).

Hi GMATNinja, How about the second "that" in that sentence? Common sense, "that are usually held by men" should modify "jobs". However, the preceding noun "comparable skill" is placed before the relative pronoun "that".

Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.
Show more
I think we sometimes get a little bit too rigid with noun modifiers, especially when they start with "which" or "that." In most cases, those modifiers will "touch" the noun being modified. But that's not an absolute rule: all modifiers just need to be as close as possible to the noun they modify -- or at least close enough to avoid any confusion about the meaning.

In this case, I see no problem at all. The phrase "that are usually held by men" doesn't just modify "jobs" in general -- it actually modifies "jobs requiring comparable skill." So the placement of "that are usually held by men" is completely fine here.

I hope this helps!
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 02 May 2021, 03:16
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sayantanc2k
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rishabchoraria



I picked A. But cannot figure why C would be wrong. Anyone who would like to take a dig at C?


Hello rishabchoraria

I can't find rule but I see some pattern:

If we have subject pronoun (I, you, he, she...) we should use "require that":

We require THAT HE BE here.
She required that everyone attend
The law now requires that parents serve on the committees that plan and evaluate school programs...

And if we have object pronoun (him, them) we should used "required to":

We require HIM TO BE here
The rules also require employers to provide safety training...
All candidates will be required to take a short test.


So it looks like in variant A we have word pay as a noun

Legislation requires employers that pay be --> This is first type of construction and pay is subject pronun so require that is correct

And in variant C we have word pay as a verb
Legislation requires employers to pay the same --> This is second type of construction and employers is object pronoun so require to is correct

If these pattern is correct then require that/require to in this question is a false split and only difference is "pay the same in jobs"
I again can't find the rule but think that pay in jobs is incorrect idiom.

Please note the following usages:

1. Require someone to do something: correct
2. Require OF someone to do something: wrong
3. Require OF someone that ...command subjunctive...: correct
4. Require OF someone that ..should... : wrong

someone = both public and private employers
something = pay
command subjunctive: be

Because of 2 above, C, D and E are wrong.
Because of 4 above B is wrong.

A is correct: it adheres to 3 above.
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I still don't understand why is (2) incorrect? "It is required of you"

A few examples from notable sources:
Did you choose to attend, or was it expected or required of you?
The new york times - https://learning.blogs.nytimes.com/2005 ... -proposal/

I guess it's what is required of you to be a Winston Cup driver
The new york times - sports - https://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/17/spor ... -pole.html

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Value your opinion. Can help, please?
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 02 May 2021, 23:20
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harshbirajdar


I still don't understand why is (2) incorrect? "It is required of you"

A few examples from notable sources:
Did you choose to attend, or was it expected or required of you?
The new york times - https://learning.blogs.nytimes.com/2005 ... -proposal/

I guess it's what is required of you to be a Winston Cup driver
The new york times - sports - https://www.nytimes.com/2002/02/17/spor ... -pole.html

VeritasKarishma GMATNinja
Value your opinion. Can help, please?
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There is nothing wrong with - "It is required of you" (meaning - it is expected of you)

What is required of a CEO? (what is she expected to do?)

In your examples, that is how it is used.

Ex 1: ... was it required of you?

Ex 2:
... asked to pose, take pictures ...
I guess it is what is required of you ...

"to be a Winston Cup driver" is not what is required of you. The public interaction is what is required of you if you want to be/become a Winston Cup driver.

You can also write it as "... to be a Winston Cup driver, it is what is required of you"

Looking at the original question:

A requires of B that pay be the same. - Subjunctive indicating a demand (active construction)

You are required to pay the same. - Correct (passive construction)
I require of you to pay the same. - Incorrect
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 08 Aug 2021, 07:07
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Not sure if this has been pointed above, but since the sentence mentions "men" at the end, plural form of the noun "jobs" should be preferred over "job" -> rendering option D wrong
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 09 Aug 2021, 10:54
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Why can’t we compare Jobs with a job? Why can’t a singular be compared with a plural? For example - my car, unlike their cars, is new. What’s wrong with this?

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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 16 Sep 2021, 04:09
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Correct Option : A

Correct usage of "that"

Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires
of both public and private employers
that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women
as for jobs requiring comparable skill
that are usually held by men.
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 03 Oct 2021, 05:12
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Require can take both subjunctive and "to + Verb". In the context of the sentence It is "the legislation", which is law/rule, and hence requires bossy tone. Thus require will become bossy verb, and needs subjunctive construct. C/D/E are out

Out of A/B it is easy: subjunctive cannot have "should". Eliminate B
Just a final check of grammar in option A. Can't se anything wrong, hence option A is right.
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 20 Nov 2021, 07:46
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TommyWallach
Hey Lonewolf,

So I've done my research, and yes, that version IS considered okay: "I require that you be here". Darnit! : )

It doesn't change the answer, however, or my explanation. Can I help further?

-tommy
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Hello !!
I have slightly diff doubt. It will be great if you can ans.

Require + that + verb in base form -> this is cool no prob.
but in this sentence it's written
require of + that + base form -> is subjunctive okay even with 'require of'.
In my knowledge, require of is similar to saying 'expected out of'

Did i make my quest clear?

Thanks in advance !!
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 22 Nov 2021, 09:11
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kunalarya
TommyWallach
Hey Lonewolf,

So I've done my research, and yes, that version IS considered okay: "I require that you be here". Darnit! : )

It doesn't change the answer, however, or my explanation. Can I help further?

-tommy

Hello !!
I have slightly diff doubt. It will be great if you can ans.

Require + that + verb in base form -> this is cool no prob.
but in this sentence it's written
require of + that + base form -> is subjunctive okay even with 'require of'.
In my knowledge, require of is similar to saying 'expected out of'

Did i make my quest clear?

Thanks in advance !!
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Hello kunalarya,

We hope this finds you well.

having gone through the question and your query, we believe we can resolve your doubt.

Yes, "require of" is also a bossy verb and can be used in the subjunctive mood construction.

We hope this helps.
All the best!
Experts' Global Team
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 07 Jan 2022, 23:44
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TommyWallach
Hey All,

A lot of conversation here, but no one has yet really gone through it piece by piece and explained what the heck is going on. I'll be that guy!

The verb "to require" can function in two ways. The first is passive: "Something is required TO do something". In this format, we have the passive voice of required. You can't go active (It's not allowed to say "He requires you to do something."), and you have to use the infinitive form of the subordinate verb. THE OTHER version of the verb "to require" is active, and forms the subjunctive of demand (We call them bossy verbs). Bossy verbs always form the same way:

BOSSY VERB CONSTRUCTION: HE demanded THAT Sheila dance.
subject normal verb always have "that" Object verb in the subjunctive

The verb in the subjunctive may be tough to recognize. However, the typical present tense form that goes with the subject "Sheila" is "dances". The subjunctive is generally formed by taking the infinitive form of the verb ("to dance") and removing the "to".

Okay. Now let's look at the question.

３． Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are
ANSWER: Here we have "requires" in the active voice, so we need the bossy verb construction. We get the THAT we need, then the object "pay", then the subjunctive form "be" (it's the infinitive "to be" without the "to"). Looks good!

(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills
PROBLEM: YOU NEVER USE SHOULD in a subjunctive construction. In fact, should gets used SO OFTEN in these types of questions, that it's worth noticing it in all the sentences you look at. Often, it signals a bossy verb subjunctive construction that you might not have noticed otherwise!

(C) to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are
PROBLEM: The "to" is wrong for the subjunctive construction. Also "in jobs" is an incorrect idiom. It should be "for jobs".

(D) to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills
PROBLEM: The "to" is wrong for the subjunctive construction. Also the parallelism is wrong. The wrong two things are being compared.

(E) to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills
PROBLEM: The "to" is wrong for the subjunctive construction. "Jobs" and "a job" aren't parallel.

Hope that helps!

-t
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Hi @TommyWallach/ DmitryFarber

I think that above explanation posted in the response for the bossy verb "require" is contradicting what MGMAT SC book suggests :

In MGMAT SC book, both the sentences have been shown as correct :

1. We require THAT HE BE here
2. We require HIM TO BE here.

The active/passive consideration is not at play in the case of the verb "require"
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 19 Jan 2022, 07:40
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.

Meaning = the law in Canada requires that the salary should the be the same for both jobs done by women and jobs done by men.

Requires "of both public and private employers" is a prepositional phrase which can be striked out. So this becomes a subjunctive mood, that the law requires "that" pay "be" the same. This structure is used for subjunctive sentences, where in a command or an order is given.
So commands/requires + that + subject (plural/singular) + plural verb.



(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are *CORRECT*= Parallelism is correct. Same "FOR" X as "FOR" Y. And the correct usage of subjunctive sentences structure.
(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills. *Incorrect* Pay for jobs should be same as for "a job". Changes the meaning.

(C) to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are *Incorrect* = Idiom error, Pay in the job is wrong. It should be pay for the job.
Eg. = The Pay for this job is very less.
Wrong = the pay "in" this job is very less.

(D) to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills. *Incorrect* = to pay is incorrect structure for subjunctive sentence.

(E) to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills. *Incorrect* = to pay is incorrect structure for subjunctive sentence.

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NarayanaGupta007
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 23 May 2022, 05:22
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smashingpumpkins
Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both public and private employers that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are usually held by men.


(A) that pay be the same for jobs historically held by women as for jobs requiring comparable skill that are

(B) that pay for jobs historically held by women should be the same as for a job requiring comparable skills

(C) to pay the same in jobs historically held by women as in jobs of comparable skill that are

(D) to pay the same regardless of whether a job was historically held by women or is one demanding comparable skills

(E) to pay as much for jobs historically held by women as for a job demanding comparable skills



Show Spoilernytimes article
https://www.nytimes.com/1989/07/27/business/a-new-ontario-law-matches-women-s-wages-with-men-s.html

Private employers in Canada's largest province are scrambling to comply with ground-breaking legislation requiring that the pay in jobs historically held by women match the pay for jobs of comparable skill that are usually done by men. In the public sector, the law has already produced substantial raises for women in secretarial and clerical jobs.
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20 Sec SOl
legislation require that -----subjective construction ...fav or GMAC use of base verb be after that
be selective rather than eliminating others in this ques
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 10 Oct 2023, 19:19
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sayantanc2k KarishmaB

Please correct me if my understanding is incorrect.

1. He required me to do X- object here is "to do X"
2. He required that I do X- object here is "I do X"
3. I was required to do X by him (Passive) - this is correct (infinitive is used, object is "to do X")
4. I was required of him to do X (Passive) - this is incorrect as object is missing?? is it because "to do X" now becomes part of the prepositional phrase " of him to do X". If yes, Cant a prep phrase ever be an object of the sentence?

The reason I am unable to understand point 4 is because when I ask "what was I required?". I get the answer as "to do X" just like in point 3. I am sure I am missing something. It would be helpful if you could throw more light on the same from the grammatical perspective.
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Legislation in the Canadian province of Ontario requires of both publi 11 Oct 2023, 00:15
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sayantanc2k KarishmaB

Please correct me if my understanding is incorrect.

1. He required me to do X- object here is "to do X"
2. He required that I do X- object here is "I do X"
3. I was required to do X by him (Passive) - this is correct (infinitive is used, object is "to do X")
4. I was required of him to do X (Passive) - this is incorrect as object is missing?? is it because "to do X" now becomes part of the prepositional phrase " of him to do X". If yes, Cant a prep phrase ever be an object of the sentence?

The reason I am unable to understand point 4 is because when I ask "what was I required?". I get the answer as "to do X" just like in point 3. I am sure I am missing something. It would be helpful if you could throw more light on the same from the grammatical perspective.
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Check out this link first: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/gramma ... ut-objects

It discusses direct/indirect objects and prepositional complements which can be used in place of objects.

1. He required me to do X- object is 'me'
2. He required that I do X- 'that clause' acts as the object of 'required'
3. I was required to do X by him (Passive) - this is correct. The object becomes the subject in passive.
4. I was required of him to do X (Passive) - Incorrect. What is the meaning of 'of him?' You could say 'I was required to do X by him.' but sentence 1 is far better phrasing.
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