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555-605 Level|   Clauses|   Modifiers|                        
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But aren't subjunctive verbs used with only that with trigger words such as demand/request/recommend?

Why does If then constructions using subjunctive verb (plural form)

Can GMATNinja please clear this for me?
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Can someone tell me since if los Angeles were to..is in between two commas doesn't it make this a non essential modifier and since this is a non essential modifier the sentence should make sense even if it's not there but it doesn't make any sense. What am I missing

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ishanliberhan
But aren't subjunctive verbs used with only that with trigger words such as demand/request/recommend?

Why does If then constructions using subjunctive verb (plural form)
Hi ishanliberhan, the sentence is using a hypothetical subjunctive: basically a subjunctive construct that should be used whenever hypothetical scenarios are depicted in a sentence.

Los Angeles metropolitan area being a separate nation, is clearly a hypothetical scenario and hence, the use of subjunctive is justified.

Some other examples of this category:

If Modiji were a cowboy, he would wear a hat.

If I were a fairy, I would don wings.

You can watch our video on Subjunctive.

p.s. Our book EducationAisle Sentence Correction Nirvana discusses subjunctive, its application and examples in significant detail. If you or someone is interested, PM me your email-id; I can mail the corresponding section.
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Deeptanshu02
Can someone tell me since if los Angeles were to..is in between two commas doesn't it make this a non essential modifier and since this is a non essential modifier the sentence should make sense even if it's not there but it doesn't make any sense. What am I missing
Hi Deeptanshu02, as you have mentioned:

portion between two commas make it a non essential modifier

So, this observation is generally true only for modifiers. In this case, it is very clear that if the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation is not a modifier, but the main clause itself. So, we cannot apply that observation here.
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Deeptanshu02
Can someone tell me since if los Angeles were to..is in between two commas doesn't it make this a non essential modifier and since this is a non essential modifier the sentence should make sense even if it's not there but it doesn't make any sense. What am I missing

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Hello Deeptanshu02,

Allow me to present my analysis to clear your doubt.


Let me present the sentence here for better understanding:


According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County, if one were to count the Los Angeles metropolitan area as a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, that is bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands.


This sentence has several parts separated by commas. So let's deal with them one by one to understand the function of each comma.

1. The sentence starts with the phrase According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County. Whenever the sentence starts with the phrase According to..., there is a comma after this phrase to separate it from the main clause. So, the first comma is the separator of the opening modifier from the main clause.

2. Now we see the structure "if + clause". The presence of "if + clause" tells us that we will see "(then) + clause" in the sentence as well. Generally, the "if + clause" and the "(then) + clause" are separated by a comma. So, that is our second comma that separates the "if" and the "then" clauses.

3. The structure after the phrase "gross national product" is the modifier for this noun entity. So, the comma after this phrase separates the noun entity and the noun modifier.


So as you can see, the "if + clause" is NOT placed between two commas as you perceive. The commas before and after "if + clause" do not make a pair because the comma before this structure belongs to the phrase According to..., and the comma after this structure separates the "if + clause" and "(then) + clause". There is nothing "non-essential" in this sentence at all.


Hope this helps. :-)
Thanks.
Shraddha
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Quote:
According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County, if one were to count the Los Angeles metropolitan area as a separate nation, it would have the world's eleventh largest gross national product, that is bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands.

A. if one were to count the Los Angeles metropolitan area as a separate nation, it would have the world's eleventh largest gross national product, that is

B. if the Los Angeles metropolitan area is counted as a separate nation, it has the world's eleventh largest gross national product, that being

C. if the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world's eleventh largest gross national product,

D. were the Los Angeles metropolitan area a separate nation, it will have the world's eleventh largest gross national product, which is

E. when the Los Angeles metropolitan area is counted as a separate nation, it has the world's eleventh largest gross national product, thus
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Hi Honorable Experts,
MartyTargetTestPrep, GMATNinja, GMATGuruNY, AjiteshArun, VeritasPrepHailey, AnthonyRitz, BrightOutlookJenn, DmitryFarber,

It seems that that refers back to gross national product in correct choice C, but why it does not refer to eleventh largest gross national product as a whole?
Here the possessive is world's. Shouldn't we count everything after possessive world's?
Thanks__
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TheUltimateWinner
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Hi Honorable Experts,
MartyTargetTestPrep, GMATNinja, GMATGuruNY, AjiteshArun, VeritasPrepHailey, AnthonyRitz, BrightOutlookJenn, DmitryFarber,

It seems that that refers back to gross national product in correct choice C, but why it does not refer to eleventh largest gross national product as a whole?
Here the possessive is world's. Shouldn't we count everything after possessive world's?
Thanks__
Hi TheUltimateWinner,

This type of that is often used to refer to part of a noun phrase. I'm not aware of any easy way to predict which adjectives may be dropped, but here looking at gross national product (GNP) as a unit that the that can refer to doesn't seem to be a problem.

It'd be good to see more opinions on this though.
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TheUltimateWinner
It seems that that refers back to gross national product in correct choice C, but why it does not refer to eleventh largest gross national product as a whole?
Here the possessive is world's. Shouldn't we count everything after possessive world's?
Thanks__
Hi! As Ajitesh rightly points out, in such cases (when that is used as a demonstrative pronoun in sentences of comparison), the intended meaning determines what that should be referring to.

For example:

Peter's car is more expensive than that of Jack.

This is a valid sentence. that is not referring to Peter's car, but to car alone.

An official example:

Some anthropologists regard the early hominids' manner of walking as less efficient than that of modern human beings.

Again, that is not referring to hominids' manner of walking, but to manner of walking.
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Can someone please explain to the reason why we use "were" instead "was," if "Los Angeles Metropolitan Statistical Area" is a singular noun ?
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Felipe28g
Can someone please explain to the reason why we use "were" instead "was," if "Los Angeles Metropolitan Statistical Area" is a singular noun ?
This issue is discussed at length earlier in this thread. Check out this post, this post, and this post, and let us know if that doesn't clear it up!
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Can somebody explain Why A is incorrect is it only for that usage?
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junii
Can somebody explain Why A is incorrect is it only for that usage?
Hi junii,

Another issue with A is that it uses a present tense is at the end. The sentence introduces a hypothetical, so the use of an is ("that is bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands") is incorrect.
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AjiteshArun
junii
Can somebody explain Why A is incorrect is it only for that usage?
Hi junii,

Another issue with A is that it uses a present tense is at the end. The sentence introduces a hypothetical, so the use of an is ("that is bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands") is incorrect.

Hi AjiteshArun,

I found your comment is interesting.
So, if I add choice(C) "which + verb", it has to use PAST TENSE to align with it would. Am I right?

According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County, if the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, which was bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands.

Thanks,
-tor
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ankaua
I chose C because of proper conditional usage. But still curries about modifier ", bigger than that of Australia, .."

"If the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world???s eleventh largest gross national product,
bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands."

I cannot remember the cases when I met such modifiers starting from comparative adjective. Could someone explain their usage? Thanks a tone! :)


yeah! same question here. can someone explain how the comparison without any pronoun or subordinate conjunction is valid?
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TorGmatGod
Hi AjiteshArun,

I found your comment is interesting.
So, if I add choice(C) "which + verb", it has to use PAST TENSE to align with it would. Am I right?

According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County, if the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, which was bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands.

Thanks,
-tor
Hi TorGmatGod,

We'd need an entire if-clause there: which would be bigger than that of X, Y, and Z, if it were ABC. However, because this is a modified version of an official question, I can't say whether the GMAT would look at this issue the same way.
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Jaya6
ankaua
I chose C because of proper conditional usage. But still curries about modifier ", bigger than that of Australia, .."

"If the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world???s eleventh largest gross national product,
bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands."

I cannot remember the cases when I met such modifiers starting from comparative adjective. Could someone explain their usage? Thanks a tone! :)


yeah! same question here. can someone explain how the comparison without any pronoun or subordinate conjunction is valid?
Hi Jaya6, modifiers starting with comparative adjective are actually quite common on GMAT and test-takers need to develop comfort level with these kind of constructs.

Another official example that uses such structure:

Officials at the United States Mint believe that the Sacagawea dollar coin will be used as a substitute for four quarters more than for the dollar bill because it weighs only 8.1 grams, far less than four quarters, which weigh 5.67 grams each.
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Soham68
I want to know.. why is "WERE" correct in the option C?

C is an example of a type 3 conditional, which combines the were in the 'condition' part of the if/then construction and 'would' in the 'then' part (of such a construction). i.e. C is a counterfactual.

According to the Economic Development Corporation of Los Angeles County, if one were to count the Los Angeles metropolitan area as a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, that is bigger than that of Australia, Mexico, or the Netherlands.

A. if one were to count the Los Angeles metropolitan area as a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, that is
-the 'that' in this sentence is ominous...not clear what it is modifying

B. if the Los Angeles metropolitan area is counted as a separate nation, it has the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, that being
-this one fudges the conditional completely...a zero conditional is not correct here, hence the present tense is wrong

C. if the Los Angeles metropolitan area were a separate nation, it would have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, CORRECT

D. were the Los Angeles metropolitan area a separate nation, it will have the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, which is
-we cannot mix 'were' with the future tense 'will' ...mix up of conditional tenses again

E. when the Los Angeles metropolitan area is counted as a separate nation, it has the world’s eleventh largest gross national product, thus
-again we can't use the present tense
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